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Oh L O FUCKING L <nationalfacepalm>
- Thread starter 'Gear
- Start date
Donovan
beer, I want beer
It sounds funny but NCLB was a garbage mandate unfunded and unworkable that rewarded schools for finding ways to label kids as learning disabled. It was a bullshit piece of legislation created by retards that is responsible for raising a whole generation of morons. It's a huge part of why my degree sits unused...
Donovan
beer, I want beer
How do you think I got the neck condition? Hours and hours of shaking my head in disgust and resignation.
NCLB looked good on paper when W rolled it out, to short-sighted uninterested members of Congress and Senate. Yeah, more school funding and higher quality teachers sounds great. The pitholes and inherent problems with standardized testing however should have been easily predictable. Still it passed overwhelmingly in both houses. Santorum is taking a beating from Ron Paul on his voting record; NCLB has been his best weapon in that regard.
Now, all the GOP candidates and Obama act like they never embraced NCLB. Santorum voted in favor (claiming now that he didn't like it but voted for it anyway hurt him more than voting for it in the first place in the Az debate a few days ago). Gingrich actually toured with Education Secretary to promote it back in 2001. For 5 years that POS legislation has been proven to be fundamentally broken and everybody knew it. It promoted the dumming down of schools and held back average and high achievers by tying money to grades and putting the testing at state level and funding at the Fed. Truly ignorant. At least the election is forcing all of the candidates to promise its reform or abolishment. Finally. Slackers.
Now, all the GOP candidates and Obama act like they never embraced NCLB. Santorum voted in favor (claiming now that he didn't like it but voted for it anyway hurt him more than voting for it in the first place in the Az debate a few days ago). Gingrich actually toured with Education Secretary to promote it back in 2001. For 5 years that POS legislation has been proven to be fundamentally broken and everybody knew it. It promoted the dumming down of schools and held back average and high achievers by tying money to grades and putting the testing at state level and funding at the Fed. Truly ignorant. At least the election is forcing all of the candidates to promise its reform or abolishment. Finally. Slackers.
No argument that the focus has been lost. But, I also believe that it's not enough to teach children to function in society. A moron can function in society; see it every day. We need to go further and teach them critical thinking skills so that they contribute and function independently in society (barring any learning disabilities, of course). I don't have the answers, but I know having the Fed's hand in it is not a solution.
I'm for handing it back to the state and local levels, but I do worry about funding when that happens.
So, basically, I dont' know shit actually. I know what's wrong, but I think the development of a "right" or "adequate" solution/improvement is a big challenge. Much smarter people than I specialize in the field and I hope that Obama or whomever inhabits the White House next gets input from qualified consultants at all levels.
I agree with you. Politics.
I fully support a local, state or regional system as an improvement over the Fed umbrella over NCLB. There needs to be a well-conceived transition plan in place for that to happen in a manner that doesn't impede the educators and the students. I don't want to see a pile of shit dumped on educators or students without adequate foresight and planning. Change management is key. Lack of it helped to get us in the current mess. Okay, off my soapbox.
I have a dream.
'Gear
RIP 1970~2018
I have kids. My wife volunteers at my younger son's school several days a week, runs the pta, oversees various inter and extra curricular activities and so forth. Additionally we're just finishing up my oldest's forth year of highschool in the same district.
Here's what we've learned - Once you finally do get access to the inner sanctum you're immediately struck by the stark reality that there is literally no one at the wheel.
You speak of people smarter than you? You might be surprised how wrong that idea turns out to be. We sure were. That why she volunteers. You want something done you roll up your sleeves, kick some drooling idiot out of the captains chair and land the fucker yourself.
Here's what we've learned - Once you finally do get access to the inner sanctum you're immediately struck by the stark reality that there is literally no one at the wheel.
You speak of people smarter than you? You might be surprised how wrong that idea turns out to be. We sure were. That why she volunteers. You want something done you roll up your sleeves, kick some drooling idiot out of the captains chair and land the fucker yourself.
I think that few jobs are more important than educating youth. Sad that you and your wife see teachers in charge of K-12 classes who don't have the necessary drive, ambition or leadership qualities to effectively manage a classroom and teach the children. I'm sure some do and they stand out like superstars. Good on you and your wife for picking up the slack and making it happen rather than whining and doing nothing.
I admire parents that get involved in their children's education. It should be the vast majority who do, but I suspect otherwise. There are qualified and caring teachers out there. I know some. Like any profession, there are the good, the bad, and the ugly. But the school administration has to be solid too. The funding (and teacher compsenation) needs to be adequate as well. We just can't seem to get it right on all fronts for K - 12. Shouldn't be glorified day care.
Donovan
beer, I want beer
As a generally pro-union guy and bleeding heart liberal I hate to say it, but the current employment structure of the teacher's union is a huge part of the problem. The tenure system not only creates an untenable situation where absolutely horrible teachers are safe to continue their jobs, but bright and talented teachers are unceremoniously shoved out the door strictly due to politics and budgetary concerns. And under the flawed NCLB act, basically the push was for schools to label as many kids "special needs" as possible in order to get a chunk of the extra funding set aside for that part of the mandate.
It's a mess, and Gear's right: no one is driving the train.
It's a mess, and Gear's right: no one is driving the train.
You just described the problem with Unions in general. I disagree with your bleeding heart on that topic daddy, but that's another thread in the making.
You, Gear and I agree on something. No one is driving the K - 12 education train. Who do you think should be driving? We all know the problems, but I would be truly interested in hearing what someone with a teaching background (or related study?) considers a viable solution.
Donovan
beer, I want beer
Aside from eliminating the "tenure" system as it exists now and allowing more freedom in hiring and firing, the other steps that could be taken include addressing the budget problems between rich and poor districts. There are far too many problems in that area alone to address in a single post, but essentially rich tax base districts should not be receiving equal funds from the government teat, school books and other sanctioned businesses should be price-regulated, and mandatory attendance should not be a measure of how schools do business, but rather a combination of census data and the needs of the community. But of course these are pipe dreams as long as powerful interests are heavily stacked in some districts and not in others.
Good to hear some solid ideas about how to fix the problem. Why are they pipe dreams, daddy? You know the facts. You are smart and caring about the subject. I don't understand why the foregone conclusion to most of your beautiful prose and intelligent solutions = forlorn futility? Powerful interests can be raped of unfair favortism with enough public pressure and/or legislation (or prosecution, if any crimes were committed in abusing said power). Interest groups are not immune to being slapped around and swatted down. Don't give up on us, daddy.