The Question
Eternal
As of right now, Safari is faster than every other browser currently available, including Chrome.
Safari 5 > All Others
- Thread starter The Question
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Further
MooGoo
Based on benchmarks run by Apple, Safari is a whole 3% faster in Javascript performance than Chrome. Obviously this is a meaningless number in any real use scenario, and does not change the fact that Safari's interface still sucks in Windows.
But just for fun, I ran some benchmarks of my own using the SunSpider Javascript Benchmark and got these results:
Chrome 6 Beta: 204.6 ms
Opera 10.6 Beta: 222.4 ms
Chrome 5: 227.2 ms
Opera 10: 227.8 ms
Safari 5: 248 ms
IE 9 Alpha: 367.8 ms
Firefox 3.6: 591.8 ms
IE 8: 3458.6 ms
Hardly an impressive showing for Safari 5, being soundly beat by stable versions of Chrome and Opera, and even more beat by the beta versions. For Apple's 3% besting of Chrome, I'm getting Chrome and Opera beating Safari by 9%, and Chrome 6 beating it by 18%.
For reference here are Apple's results using the SunSpider benchmark:
Safari 5.0 266 ms
Chrome 5.0 273 ms
Opera 10.53 313 ms
Firefox 3.6.3 780 ms
The small difference in overall speed might be attributed to Apple running its tests on a 3.06GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, and my tests being run on a 3.2GHz Intel Core i7 920.
Other benchmarks around the interwebs post varied results, but in general Chrome and Opera seem to match or come out slightly ahead of Safari 5 (and Chrome 6 always wins by a greater margin).
Perhaps Safari fares better on OS X, but there most people already use Safari as their default browser. It is on Windows where Apple has to prove themselves, and it is going to take more than marginally faster artificial benchmark results.
Besides improved performance Safari 5 does not seem to offer much. Most of its new features have been available in other browsers for ages now or available as plugins/extensions. In fact the addition of 3rd party extension support is probably the most exciting new feature in Safari 5 which might eventually put it on par with Chrome as far as customizability goes.
Alas I doubt either browser will ever approach Firefox in the relm of extensibility, which is why I still use it as my default browser despite it being clearly slower in benchmarks than Chrome.
If you really feel the need to pimp Apple products, I would stick with the iPhone 4 for now, which is an impressive piece of hardware with some features (screen resolution) currently unmatched by any competitor.
So enjoy it while it lasts, because as with most Apple products, the small lead attained when released is quickly overtaken by the competition, after which said product spends the rest of its life lagging behind as Apple drags its feet on updates.
But just for fun, I ran some benchmarks of my own using the SunSpider Javascript Benchmark and got these results:
Chrome 6 Beta: 204.6 ms
Opera 10.6 Beta: 222.4 ms
Chrome 5: 227.2 ms
Opera 10: 227.8 ms
Safari 5: 248 ms
IE 9 Alpha: 367.8 ms
Firefox 3.6: 591.8 ms
IE 8: 3458.6 ms
Hardly an impressive showing for Safari 5, being soundly beat by stable versions of Chrome and Opera, and even more beat by the beta versions. For Apple's 3% besting of Chrome, I'm getting Chrome and Opera beating Safari by 9%, and Chrome 6 beating it by 18%.
For reference here are Apple's results using the SunSpider benchmark:
Safari 5.0 266 ms
Chrome 5.0 273 ms
Opera 10.53 313 ms
Firefox 3.6.3 780 ms
The small difference in overall speed might be attributed to Apple running its tests on a 3.06GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, and my tests being run on a 3.2GHz Intel Core i7 920.
Other benchmarks around the interwebs post varied results, but in general Chrome and Opera seem to match or come out slightly ahead of Safari 5 (and Chrome 6 always wins by a greater margin).
Perhaps Safari fares better on OS X, but there most people already use Safari as their default browser. It is on Windows where Apple has to prove themselves, and it is going to take more than marginally faster artificial benchmark results.
Besides improved performance Safari 5 does not seem to offer much. Most of its new features have been available in other browsers for ages now or available as plugins/extensions. In fact the addition of 3rd party extension support is probably the most exciting new feature in Safari 5 which might eventually put it on par with Chrome as far as customizability goes.
Alas I doubt either browser will ever approach Firefox in the relm of extensibility, which is why I still use it as my default browser despite it being clearly slower in benchmarks than Chrome.
If you really feel the need to pimp Apple products, I would stick with the iPhone 4 for now, which is an impressive piece of hardware with some features (screen resolution) currently unmatched by any competitor.
So enjoy it while it lasts, because as with most Apple products, the small lead attained when released is quickly overtaken by the competition, after which said product spends the rest of its life lagging behind as Apple drags its feet on updates.
SAUSAGEMAN
Registered User
I have basically blown away by the "Reader" feature - I'm never reading any news site any other way, ever. It makes any terrible site design readable and pleasant.
Safari supremacy.
Safari supremacy.
Conchaga
Let's fuck some shit up
I'm all about interface and adaptability when it comes to my browser. So, I go with ff. Yes, even though I'm running it on a mac, I don't care.
However, the Mail app is heads and shoulders above thunderbird or outlook.
Unfortunately, there aren't tons of third-party mail readers out there.
However, the Mail app is heads and shoulders above thunderbird or outlook.
Unfortunately, there aren't tons of third-party mail readers out there.
Further
MooGoo
Been there, done that:
http://lab.arc90.com/experiments/readability/
https://chrome.google.com/extensions/detail/jggheggpdocamneaacmfoipeehedigia
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/46442/
Safari is still behind every other decent browser (not IE) out there feature wise.
SAUSAGEMAN
Registered User
Those are add-ons, not core browser features.
Further
MooGoo
So? The point is that the "Reader" feature of Safari 5 is just a direct rip of Readability which is easily usable on any browser that supports Bookmarklets (every modern browser). And extensions are not exactly a niche thing only employed by UNIX kernel hackers, they are widely used in every browser that supports them.
A feature that is already available on every web browser (and more flexible to boot) is hardly a point towards "Safari supremacy".
A feature that is already available on every web browser (and more flexible to boot) is hardly a point towards "Safari supremacy".
SAUSAGEMAN
Registered User
Meh, I just don't really do extensions, it feels like they really slow down Firefox, which is already nigh-unusable on OS X. Haven't tried Chrome, because I don't really need a second WebKit browser.
I'm in no way advocating using Safari on Windows, though. Nobody's insane enough to do that, right?
(Well, I do, but that's because of MobileMe syncing bookmarks between Safari on OS X, on Windows, and iPhone.)
I'm in no way advocating using Safari on Windows, though. Nobody's insane enough to do that, right?
(Well, I do, but that's because of MobileMe syncing bookmarks between Safari on OS X, on Windows, and iPhone.)
Conchaga
Let's fuck some shit up
I'm a ff user on a mac and it isn't slow for me at all. besides, do you really care that it takes 500ms to open a web page? Can you even register that? NO. So, just shut the fuck up and enjoy the browser of your choice.
I mean, with ridiculous-fast ISP speeds, ANYTHING is fine.
I mean, with ridiculous-fast ISP speeds, ANYTHING is fine.
Further
MooGoo
Firefox can be slower to start than Chrome but otherwise I find it just as fast. It is possible that some extensions might slow it down, but then those extensions are buggy and probably should not be used in the first place.
My biggest problem with Safari and Chrome and any browser that shoves all its tabs in a single row bar is that with more than a handful of tabs open the tab bar becomes unusable.
I'm usually rocking at least several dozen tabs at any time, so being able to view them in a vertical sidebar is essential. Firefox has this ability through extensions and Opera has it built in (though it's implementation is far inferior). I doubt whether Chrome's extension API will ever allow such a drastic UI modification, much less Safari's.
But beyond that, you can appreciate extensions even while not using them, as you generally do not have to deal with new features like "Reader" if you do not want them. Personally I have no use for that feature, and found no easy way to disable it in Safari. Opera is a worse offender in the category of unwanted features, it comes with a torrent program built in for christs sake, whoop-di-do.
Some people might like the bling in Safari, but I find it pointless. I mean...does the speed dial you get when you open a new tab really have to be curved? According to Apple it does, and there's nothing I can do to change it. In Firefox, if I actually wanted this feature, there's an extension for it.
My biggest problem with Safari and Chrome and any browser that shoves all its tabs in a single row bar is that with more than a handful of tabs open the tab bar becomes unusable.
I'm usually rocking at least several dozen tabs at any time, so being able to view them in a vertical sidebar is essential. Firefox has this ability through extensions and Opera has it built in (though it's implementation is far inferior). I doubt whether Chrome's extension API will ever allow such a drastic UI modification, much less Safari's.
But beyond that, you can appreciate extensions even while not using them, as you generally do not have to deal with new features like "Reader" if you do not want them. Personally I have no use for that feature, and found no easy way to disable it in Safari. Opera is a worse offender in the category of unwanted features, it comes with a torrent program built in for christs sake, whoop-di-do.
Some people might like the bling in Safari, but I find it pointless. I mean...does the speed dial you get when you open a new tab really have to be curved? According to Apple it does, and there's nothing I can do to change it. In Firefox, if I actually wanted this feature, there's an extension for it.
The Question
Eternal
Further said:
I have -- don't click it.
The Question
Eternal
You remind me of my former roommate. He'll trash-talk Apple all day long, come up with all kinds of reasons why the cobbled-together patchwork of Firefox is better than the end-to-end organic solution of Safari, or go on at length about how the iPhone is just a horrible piece of junk, etc., etc.
It's not about that. It's about bashing whichever company is at the top. Being trendy by trying way too hard to be anything but trendy.
I'm not impressed. Go drink your goat-milk latte and watch an incomprehensible David Lynch film, faggot. We're talking technology in here.
It's not about that. It's about bashing whichever company is at the top. Being trendy by trying way too hard to be anything but trendy.
I'm not impressed. Go drink your goat-milk latte and watch an incomprehensible David Lynch film, faggot. We're talking technology in here.
Further
MooGoo
All kinds of reasons eh? Remind me again who started this thread? You know, the one about how Safari is better than all other web browsers because it scored 3% higher in Javascript performance in Apple run benchmarks. Apparently you are just as much of a goat-milk latte drinking fagot as I am.
I'm all for name calling, really, it just wouldn't be the internets without it. But if you could take a brief recess from sucking Steve Job's balls and explain to me why my thorough debunking of Apple's performance claims is faulty, what exactly about Safari makes it superior to all other web browsers, and wtf "end-to-end organic solution" means (maybe it means goat-milk), then I'd be very impressed.
And trust me I'm not bashing Apple because they are on top, as they are quite literally on the bottom as far as web browser market share goes (a distinction shared with Opera). Google Chrome, which has been out for a fraction of Safari's lifespan (and even less so with the Linux and OS X versions), is already ahead. There's a reason for this; Safari sucks on Windows. No this is not Window's fault. It is Apple's and it is a problem with most of their Windows ports.
Also if you actually bothered to read my posts you would have noticed that I praised the new iPhone hardware in two threads on this board.
So...please, talk some technology to me, because so far I've only heard Apple Fanboy bullshit.
I'm all for name calling, really, it just wouldn't be the internets without it. But if you could take a brief recess from sucking Steve Job's balls and explain to me why my thorough debunking of Apple's performance claims is faulty, what exactly about Safari makes it superior to all other web browsers, and wtf "end-to-end organic solution" means (maybe it means goat-milk), then I'd be very impressed.
And trust me I'm not bashing Apple because they are on top, as they are quite literally on the bottom as far as web browser market share goes (a distinction shared with Opera). Google Chrome, which has been out for a fraction of Safari's lifespan (and even less so with the Linux and OS X versions), is already ahead. There's a reason for this; Safari sucks on Windows. No this is not Window's fault. It is Apple's and it is a problem with most of their Windows ports.
Also if you actually bothered to read my posts you would have noticed that I praised the new iPhone hardware in two threads on this board.
So...please, talk some technology to me, because so far I've only heard Apple Fanboy bullshit.
The Question
Eternal
Actually, that would be you. Here's what I said:
And on my system, based on my subjective experience, it happens to be true. You're the one who went on a horn-rimmed pocket-protector-sporting crusade over it. So fuck off.
Further
MooGoo
So I take it this thread was created merely because you just happened to have run benchmarks in your head comparing Safari's speed to every other browser currently available and wanted to share the results yes? Not at all because you read any one of the hundreds of news articles posted mere hours before you started this thread about Apple's Safari 5 press release in which was clearly stated AND I QUOTE "...Safari 5 on the Mac runs JavaScript 30 percent faster than Safari 4, three percent faster than Chrome 5.0...".
You see...I was just trying to help elaborate on your ZOMG SAFARI IS TEH FASTEST BROWSER IN THE UNIVERSE statement. If I had known that it was simply an unprompted random outpouring of Apple Fagotry I would have posted the quote in the first place. SO SORRY.
Based on my subjective experience however, Safari is a piece of crap. I simply felt it would be a good idea to go on a 15 minute horn-rimmed benchmarking crusade to make sure I was not talking out of my ass. But srsly, what was I thinking? This is an internet argument about Apple after all, clearly facts are not welcome.
Don't worry, next time I'll try to keep my arguments at your level. Something like...WINDOWS KICKS THE SHIT OUT OF OS X IN VIDEO GAME PERFORMANCE. APPLE < POOP
You see...I was just trying to help elaborate on your ZOMG SAFARI IS TEH FASTEST BROWSER IN THE UNIVERSE statement. If I had known that it was simply an unprompted random outpouring of Apple Fagotry I would have posted the quote in the first place. SO SORRY.
Based on my subjective experience however, Safari is a piece of crap. I simply felt it would be a good idea to go on a 15 minute horn-rimmed benchmarking crusade to make sure I was not talking out of my ass. But srsly, what was I thinking? This is an internet argument about Apple after all, clearly facts are not welcome.
Don't worry, next time I'll try to keep my arguments at your level. Something like...WINDOWS KICKS THE SHIT OUT OF OS X IN VIDEO GAME PERFORMANCE. APPLE < POOP
The Question
Eternal
I wasn't speaking from a 10-key, poindexter. I was speaking from experience. I had Firefox. I had Chrome. I had Safari 4. Safari 5 is faster than all of 'em, based once again on first-hand experience.
The only real "benchmark" that I give a flying fuck about is my experience of the product. Use all the numbers you want to dispute that -- you're wasting your time and making yourself look like an inept dick.
The Question
Eternal
Sorry, fella, but I still haven't read a press release. I was hoping to get my hands on iTunes 9.2, but Safari 5 was what came up on Software Update. So tough shit, somebody likes Apple products because Apple products work, work well and continue to work better all the time. Get over it.
Further
MooGoo
OKAY FINE THEN. Since you said "AS OF NOW" in your original post I'll just have to assume that when you first started Safari 5 the raw speed of it must have hit you so hard that you immediately launched Chrome and FELT that 3% difference then quickly posted this thread in excitement before you splooged your pants.
Either that or you're full of shit, just like Apple.
Either that or you're full of shit, just like Apple.