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Student Question of the Day

Okay, I don't even need to know where he went to school. Let's look at one of his old posts:

I will say this: I grew up in what is now a ghetto (Southwest Philadelphia). We were poor to the point that my single Mother had to go on welfare for two years while she completed technical training in the health care field. I didn't go to Private School; I studied my ass off to go to the best public "magnet" school in the city, Central High. Mommy & Daddy didn't pay my way through college, I got grants, student loans, and worked 30 hours a week to put myself through college. I decided that I wanted a better life for myself, so I went out and did the hard work to ensure that I would have a better life. I'm not rich, neither am I living paycheck to paycheck. I'm very comfortably in the middle, largely due to the fact that I am fiscally responsible in addition to being well-educated and hard-working.

So excuse me if I don't use what little free time and money I have to help the "downtrodden" or "less fortunate". My mother certainly didn't have anyone helping her when we were poor growing up.
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LINK: http://www.trollkingdom.net/forum/showpost.php?p=186207&postcount=35

Ironically, BDM is a perfect example of how we can use government to give people opportunity. His mother was able to train for a job because of welfare. BDM himself attented a public school, which was paid for by local tax payers and, because it was a magnet school, by federal desgregation funds. In college, he recieved federal financial aid, also funded by his fellow citizens. Because of these federal, state and local programs, he had the opportunity to move up into the middle class. All of these programs--from welfare to federal aid for public schools to financial aid--were passed by *GASP!* liberals who believed that government is a way for us all to come together and give everyone in our society, no matter how humble their origins, an opportunity to succeed.

BDM's particular case points to a larger truth: the United States would not be the economic power it is today if the federal government hadn't been used to promote economic growth and well-being. The U.S. is dominant in so many cutting edge industries because government has put tons of money towards basic and applied research, and has provided considerable support for higher education. Our current standard of living relies on using the government to drive innovation and train a highly educated work force.

I'd really like to know why people like BDM and Number_6 can't acknowledge that using government wisely is necessary to maintain our way of life. BDM's above quoted post is an especially perplexing example. In the first paragraph he says " my single Mother had to go on welfare for two years," and in the second paragraph he says " My mother certainly didn't have anyone helping her when we were poor growing up." So, she was on welfare for two years, but she didn't have anyone helping her? how does that work? BDM can go on until he's blue in the face about how I don't have the necessary life experiences to really understand government policy, but I don't think BDM understands his own life expereinces. If you can claim that your mother was on welfare and that she never had help in the same breath, you're deluding yourself about your own life. If you were honest with yourself about your life experiences, I think you would appreciate the role government has had in giving you opportunities to succeed.
 
Using government wisely, "wisely" being the key word in Wordin's diatribe above.

I have no problem with paying some taxes. What I do have a problem with is paying for lazy motherfuckers to sit on their leather couches in front of their big screen TVs talking on their cell phones while I'm footing the bill. I have problems with people who deliberately have children while single in order to collect from the system.

And I have problems with rich assholes who think that I should be paying more into the system while they use ever dodge under the sun to avoid paying as much tax as possible.

You're a privileged little snot, Wordin. In my book, that means you need to shut the fuck up about things that really don't concern you, like worrying about where next month's food and gas money is going to come from, and wondering whether the government will take even more of your paycheck next year than they're already taking.
 
Number_6 said:
I have no problem with paying some taxes. What I do have a problem with is paying for lazy motherfuckers to sit on their leather couches in front of their big screen TVs talking on their cell phones while I'm footing the bill. I have problems with people who deliberately have children while single in order to collect from the system.
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Number_6, I agree with you. When I went back to my old 'hood in March on a family emergency, it pissed me off no end that I saw people from the neighboring housing project walking around with gold chains and cell phones. That's not how I want my tax dollars spent. If you are hungry, I will feed you. But I will not buy you a fucking gold chain to adorn your neck.

What we need is some serious reform. Clinton's previous 5 year plan failed miserably. We need a foolproof method of discerning the needy from the
abusers.

Workfare didn't work. What is needed is a realistic, common sense approach to the transition from being government dependent, to independent.
 
Wordin, welfare is a loan. Didn't you know that? My Mom had to pay back every cent we ever got in welfare, in the form of wage garnishment. See, that's what most people don't realize, because the majority of welfare recipients don't ever get jobs so they can't pay back the loan.

Ok, you're right, my Mom got a helping hand from Uncle Sugar for two years. Wanna know how much she got to support a family of three? $400 a month, plus $100 in food stamps. Yes, my dad paid child support, but she received no alimony because he was broke. Thank God my Mother had some drive, and some savings, or she'd probably never have gotte off welfare.

Yes, I went to a public school. In Philadelphia, as in most other areas, public schools are funded by School Taxes, NOT income taxes. Thus, they only apply to those people who own property. Whether they have kids who use the public school sytem or not.

As far as grants for college, I got a $1,000 a year grant from my Mom's work. Not per semester, per year. See, when you're a white boy living in a predominantely black and Puerto Rican city, you don't get scholarships, even if your grades are stellar. Unless you can play sports at a very high level, which I could not.

So, I took out student loans. PHEAA loans, to be exact. That's the Pennsylvania Higher Education Assistance Association. It's a quasi-government organization that supplies loans to people who don't qualify for Federal Financial Aid assitance. Why didn't I qualify? Because I had to work to afford the balance of my tuition, plus books and transportation costs. My income, when combined with that of my divorced parent's income, was considered too much for standard student loans. I think we made something like $30,000 a year combined back then. Pitiful.

Yes, I got a bit of a helping hand from the government. But I also worked my ass off to stay in school and work for my books and my transportation. I didn't have anyone else to bail me out; if they cut my hours I was screwed.

I never said I had a problem with school taxes or federal grants for students.
 
Welfare is supposed to be a safety net, not a lifetime "job."

I have no problem with welfare so long as it is used as a safety net, and not as a permanent source of income. What I have a problem with is the rampant abuse of the system, and the fact that the middle class is asked to bear an unfair share of the burden of keeping the system afloat. I particularly have this problem when very wealthy people are shaking their finger at me and telling me I need to give up more to help those in need.
 
What I have a problem with is the rampant abuse of the system, and the fact that the middle class is asked to bear an unfair share of the burden of keeping the system afloat.
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What percentage of the federal budget do you think goes to welfare payments? Take a guess.
 
You tell me, Wordin. Then tell me what percentage of each state's budget is spent on state welfare programs. Then tell me what the total federal budget is, then tell me what each state's total budget is. Then tell me how much money is being spent on welfare. The lowest number I've found--and this was for 1994--was $16.9 billion, and this just federal money spent in the Aid to Families with Dependent Children program. The largest I found, which supposedly includes all government expeditures made to parties who pay nothing into the common pool, is $289.9 billion (this being federal, state, and local forms of aid). This was for 1992.

Tell you what, Wordin. You tell me where you go to school. Tell me how you're paying for tuition. Then tell me what your parents' income for the 2004 tax year was. Give me a complete list of all the jobs you've ever worked at, the pay, and the reason why you felt it necessary to take the job. Also, I'd like to know what you spent the money you earned on.

You provide all that information, and then I'll think about what response other than "Shut the fuck up, you spoiled little twat" might be appropriate.
 
Here's the 2006 budget for welfare:

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LINK: http://www.gpoaccess.gov/usbudget/fy06/pdf/appendix/hhs.pdf

The total federal budget for 2006 is 2.567617 trillion.

16881/2567617=0.00657

Welfare is less than 1% of the federal budget.

I don't understand why you guys are so obsessed with poor people. The most abused program in government is not welfare, but crop insurance. Farmers literaly whack the leaves off their plants, sprinkle cocktail ice on the ground, and file for hail damage. If you want waste, Congress has just passed an absolutely atrocious transportation bill containing billions in unecessary pork. These are the things we should focus on if we want to reduce waste.
 
Farmers literaly whack the leaves off their plants, sprinkle cocktail ice on the ground, and file for hail damage.
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Wouldn't that sort of hinge on their being hail in the given area at a given time?
 
Wouldn't that sort of hinge on their being hail in the given area at a given time?
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Yeah, but the system isn't good at catching that sort of thing. Farmers don't go directly to the government to collect the insurance, they go to private insurance companies that then bill the government. Private insurers make money off the claims, so they don't check them out carefully enough.
 
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