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Universal Healthcare

The Amazing Messenger

The Amazing Messenger

New member
I support very few collectivist programs, but other countries have been able to implement it in some basic form without the universe exploding. It would be better not to have it, but only if other collectivist programs and stifling regulations go out the window as well.

Anyone here who supports unnecessary wars, but believes that at all costs, universal healthcare in the US should not be implemented?

47 million Americans are uninsured, with millions more under-ensured. What worth the dollar has is being sunk into a military-industrial complex that will fall flat on its face sooner or later. That's pretty embarrassing.

It would be preferable to tolerate paying into a system of health care and not making weapons contractors wealthier, or paying extra for gasoline and everything else thanks to the comedic attempts of the current White House administration at running the world.
 
Sugar dumpling, you are not making any sense. Your issues don't correlate. Paying for universal healthcare will not stop wars - unnecessary or otherwise. People who will war will always find someone to war with.
 
eloisel said:
Sugar dumpling, you are not making any sense. Your issues don't correlate. Paying for universal healthcare will not stop wars - unnecessary or otherwise. People who will war will always find someone to war with.
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Sweet predictable vapid bitch, I'm saying there are far worse things you can be forced to pay for. How people can be confronted with wars started by lies, giant wasteful bureaucracy, taxpayer funded torture, subsidized illegal immigration, the NAU, but be especially up in arms over healthcare, when it is available in many other countries that enjoy a standard of living equal to or greater than the US, is laughable.
 
I'm bumping this thread because I saw Sicko last night on Showtime. All my life I've been against socialized medicine, now I'm wondering if I was just indoctrinated to feel that way. I know.. that's silly considering I just watched a liberal documentary about it, but Moore made good points. I used to hate his guts (still do a little) but Sicko was damn interesting. I feel my once firm resolve against socialized medicine slipping away.

I was wondering how people here feel about nationalized health care. If you live in a country like Canada or Britain, are you satisfied with the state run health care system? Do you pay outrageous taxes? Do you have to wait a long time to see a doctor? If you're an American, why are you for or against Universal Health Care?
 
The NHS, especially, has an incredible reputation for sucking. Bad.

As for Sicko - well, it's a Michael Moore movie and therefore bound to be full of fail. Just go to Wikipedia or something and look up all his usual distortions.

As for why universal healthcare is "bad": it's all the usual reasons whenever you want to nationalize something. The government just isn't very good at running shit.
 
Are you happy with the way the insurance companies run the health care industry?
 
Laker_Girl said:
Why I am against Universal Healthcare:

It's quite simple, competition breeds excellence.
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I'm still waiting for the 'excellence' part to happen. The 'competition' part has pretty much made it unaffordable and, for the most part, unattainable for most folks.
 
How would things be affected if insurance companies were required to be nonprofits? I suspect that many of the same problems would persist in a slightly different form, and all fingers would be pointing at R&D, ie pharmaceutical companies. But should they not make so much money? They *are* the medical R&D community.

BTW, I don't know how many of you know this but Pfizer just recently bought Wyeth. Yes, that is a big deal.
 
I don't have a problem with companies making a profit, I believe in capitalism. BUT.. when these companies have so much influence over the govt I don't like it. They make huge profits and spend a lot of it on making sure laws are passed (or blocked from passage) that benefit them.

I have no idea if this website is biased or not http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/indus.php?ind=H04
 
Get all our troops out of the middle east. Additionally, get all our weapons out of the middle east, especially the ones not being wielded by Americans. No more free dough or weapons for Israel. That gets the ragheads off our backs, which is the only legitimate objective for having a military presence there in the first place.
 
As for free health care -- illegal aliens have been enjoying that for years. The closures of hospitals throughout the Southwestern U.S. is a testament to the genius of free health care.
 
The Saint said:
As for free health care -- illegal aliens have been enjoying that for years. The closures of hospitals throughout the Southwestern U.S. is a testament to the genius of free health care.
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You, my friend, are a complete and total moron. There is NO SUCH THING as 'free health care'. How the fuck do you think the doctors get paid? The nurses? The fucking janitors? How does the fucking hospital pay its fucking bills? Now, as a Canadian who knows about such matters, PLEASE SHUT THE FUCK UP.
 
Laker_Girl said:
Why I am against Universal Healthcare:

It's quite simple, competition breeds excellence.
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You, the typical LakerGirl dumbass, have not a clue. I do remember your stupidity, but here it is glaring. That very same competition forces insurance companies also to keep their costs down to a minimum. How do they do this? BY FIGHTING EVERY CLAIM THERE IS, TOOTH AND NAIL, SUCH THAT YOU WOULD REQUIRE A LAWYER TO OBTAIN MONIES YOU ARE ENTITLED TO. I absolutely abhor this typical American stupidity. Obviously, Americans ignore the horror stories behind hospital stays in the US, where one requires an operation, fills out his/her insurance form, has the operation, ONLY TO BE TOLD THE INSURANCE COMPANY WILL NOT PAY IT! What the fuck is the point of having insurance of your insurers tell you to go fuck yourself, even after years and years of paying premiums?
 
Gonad said:
How would things be affected if insurance companies were required to be nonprofits? I suspect that many of the same problems would persist in a slightly different form, and all fingers would be pointing at R&D, ie pharmaceutical companies. But should they not make so much money? They *are* the medical R&D community.

BTW, I don't know how many of you know this but Pfizer just recently bought Wyeth. Yes, that is a big deal.
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You dumb shit. What would be the point of even having insurance companies if the industry was to become non-profit?

As for the pharmaceutical companies, they point at my country and scream that we are creating copies of their drugs. Much of this is bullshit. Believe it or not, those Americans who travel to Canada to purchase our cheaper drugs ARE PURCHASING THE VERY SAME DRUGS FOUND IN THE US, MANUFACTURED BY THE SAME COMPANIES, BUT ONLY AT A CHEAPER PRICE! Many Americans believe our drugs are cheaper because of our 'socialist' policies. The policies that make our drugs cheaper for Canadians is not 'socialist', it is FASCIST. Our government allows itself to be approached by American drug companies who offer to sell us their drugs at a price they set. Our government looks at the price they have offered, laughs, then tells them to go fuck themselves. Then, our government smiles at the drug company representative, writes on a piece of paper, and TELLS them 'THIS is what you assholes will charge us, or get the fuck out of Canada. We will either make them ourselves, or go to someone else', to which the drug company agrees. This is FASCISM at its greatest, because the government is regulating the drug industry, and ORDERING the plundering drug companies about.

Every time an American drug company tells us to fuck off, we smile, head over to one of our own drug companies, and tell them 'feel free to manufacture THIS drug, and sell it to us at this price', to which the company agrees. The drug we manufacture turns out to be an EXACT COPY of the drug from the company that turned us down. This enrages the American drug companies, because they spend all that R&D cash on developing the drug, to which we simply reverse-engineer the drug, copy it and produce it. Every time the American drug companies whine, we Canadians point at them and laugh our fucking asses off.
 
SaintLucifer said:
You, my friend, are a complete and total moron. There is NO SUCH THING as 'free health care'. How the fuck do you think the doctors get paid? The nurses? The fucking janitors? How does the fucking hospital pay its fucking bills? Now, as a Canadian who knows about such matters, PLEASE SHUT THE FUCK UP.
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Taxes pay for it, obviously, unless the hundreds of thousands, or millions, who use it don't pay taxes -- as in the case of illegal aliens, which is the case I mentioned.

So turn off the obnoxious bullshit font and take a powder, dipshit.
 
The Saint said:
Taxes pay for it, obviously, unless the hundreds of thousands, or millions, who use it don't pay taxes -- as in the case of illegal aliens, which is the case I mentioned.

So turn off the obnoxious bullshit font and take a powder, dipshit.
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Illegal aliens pay taxes, do they not? It is ILLEGAL to give someone a paycheque without any tax deductions. So, even those who shouldn't even be in the USA, and are therefore not citizens, pay into the USA healthcare program. I should like to remind you, dumbass, that the US 'socialised system' is far larger than our own. This is what makes me laugh every time a fucking American points at our healthcare system, and cries out that we are socialists. That is how truly stupid you Americans are.
 
Cassie said:
Fake Luci strikes again!
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You are so intimidated by me that you run around screaming that I am a fake. Obviously, I have done more damage to you in our previous altercations than I had first suspected. This is your way of coping, by pretending that I am not the famous individual who ripped you to shreds without so much as breaking into the slightest of sweats. Do carry on.
 
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