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Who's to blame for Africa's plight?

RWC

New member
The United States has already provided $1.4 billion to Africa this year through the United Nations and separately pledged $15 billion to fight AIDS in Africa over the next decade.

The United States supports debt cancellation and is the world leader in terms of African aid. U.S. senators from Left to Right are supporting the G-8, and Bush's bid to wipe out some $40 to $56 billion worth of the poorest countries' debts.

Bush also called for the settlement of wars in Africa, and said America would train 40,000 African peacekeepers.

Bush called for a $1.2 billion US effort to cut deaths from malaria in Africa by half over five years.

Bush proposed doubling US spending to $400 million on initiatives to promote the education of girls in Africa and said he wanted Congress to approve $55 million over three years to improve legal protections for women in Africa against violence and sexual abuse.

Bush has already trebled aid to Africa since coming to office, and that will double again by 2010.

And, if you want to blame somebody for Africa's plight, you might start with blaming Africa.
 
Well, I have to agree with you here. While a lion's share of the blame can be placed on Europe, particularly countries like Belgium, who really fucked up Africa during the colonial period, the current problems Africa is suffering from are the result of corrupt governments who are not allowing the aid to trickle down to the general population.

They are also not using the aid to help themselves to make more efficient use of their own natural resources, and to compete in the world economy.

And then there's the rampant tribalism, as we've seen in Rwanda and now in Sudan.
 
This reminds me of one of my Stormfront rants . . .





Let’s talk some more. Or you just listen and disagree, then deconstruct my post piece by piece in little quote boxes or something.

There are plenty of tangents in this post, so please watch your step.

How do you see the world today? How do you see it tomorrow? Will Africans still be starving? Will there be peace in the Middle East? Will we all love each other?

I turn on my television and I see all sorts of organizations clamor to give food to the starving African child. How long have they been doing that? Have there been any real results? Let’s talk about that. Let’s talk about the appeal to emotion that something can be done, simply because the gruesome alternative of mass starvation and bloody genocide perpetually tearing a continent apart is too horrible to accept as a very real possibility.

Is this wise? Should a tangible problem be approached with intangible emotionalism? "70 cents a day" hasn't done much.

IMHO, the charity helps to maintain the status quo of Africans not having any real clout in the world by giving the illusion that something can change, when there are undoubtedly forces working against that. After all, water finds its own level.

“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today. Teach a man to fish, and you have fed him for a lifetime.”

People can claim there are various reasons for the general dismal situations that sub-Saharan African nations find themselves in. Let’s put the biological arguments aside, which I'm sure many antis have been exposed to. Why the sudden collapse of formerly prosperous African nations? Is it due to simple racism on the part of former colonial empires?

Before Europeans, what did Africans have, nation-wise? Were they much different from the Yanomami? What would happen if a group of colonists/administrators organized them into a single nation, and then simply up and left one day, leaving behind advanced technology and medicine?

Gold was recently found in Yanomami territory and the inevitable influx of miners that arrived soon after have brought with them disease, alcoholism, and violence, which promptly resonated in the warrior culture of the Yanomami themselves, coupled with their version of animism which rituals incorporate entorpecents. Yanomami culture was in a real threat of disappearing from Earth entirely, and have been protected by Brazilian national parks with donations from the First World.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yanomamo

How much do the Yanomami differ from the bygone Aztecs or Incas that they wouldn’t be able to recreate those pyramids and calendars? We know that intermittent contact with people higher on the ladder of civilization had severely disrupted the Yanomami way of life. Did this simply occur with sub-Saharan Africans, with a much larger gap between the groups of people which came into contact with each other?

This is something I find myself thinking to more and more, and which no one asks often. Were Africans culturally prepared take the reigns of an entity as massive as a nation? The citizens Pre-Columbian South American empires had literature, agriculture, cities, calenders. South America is far from obviously far from perfect. However, their civil wars are more along ideological lines, and not the wholesale slaughter and destitution we see and hear about in Africa. The bounderies of African nations look like a jigsaw puzzle. The true bounderies exist along tribal lines.

Many of the members of the civilized world take pride in their respective histories to the point where maintaining unity on a macroscopic scale, like a nation, becomes part of heritage. Africans do not have a comparable heritage, and I respect that it couldn’t be easy to be plopped down on the Earth and wander aimlessly, seeking solidarity based solely on skin color.

Blaming whites for the whole mess makes as much sense as pulling the cement out of a brick wall, and then blaming the cement for the collapse. Blaming whites for being there in the first place is just as pointless. Would the Arabs and northeast Asians be any more considerate to the 'free lunch' which Africa was?

Interestingly enough, I see that very reason cited for not pulling out of Iraq. People will blame whites for not helping Africans more, and for "helping" Iraqis too much. Damned either way.

What of the Middle East? I recall one nutjob anti claiming that Bush's selfless crusade to bring "democracy" to the Middle East is motivated by (you guessed it) racism.

If any of you are really informed of what's going on over there, then you would know how Israel can (and has) gotten away with practically everything. Either way, it is undeniable that there are many problems which plague the Middle East (I personally prefer the term 'symptom.') What's your 'anti' solution to them, contra to our nationalist thinking?

This goes back to the Realpolitik aspect of the world that is so largely ignored by ‘do-gooders.’ Think about it, antis. It has nothing to do with racism. If India were a First World nation, would it somehow be more inclined to donate food and money than Western nations to Africa because they associate with "brown pride?" I don’t think so. Ask yourself: What ‘sane’ and well-do-to nation would create more competition for itself on the global market?

The nations of the world are the result of macrocosmic evolution in which only the strong survived. They aren’t going to realistically ‘give it up.' They'll give aid to seem kind, and pull the wool over people's eyes to convince everyone that there is enough food for everyone, and that the problem boils down to the simple matter of 'getting the books in order.'

Just because we live in some sort of ‘enlightened’ age doesn’t mean the rules of the game have changed – they’ve only been given new names. Instead of “our financial interests in the region,” we hear “to promote peace and stability.”

Do you think that if some sort of grand Red Revolution washed over the face of the Earth that there would be no more purges and dead people, no more competition and starving children?

I find it laughable when Western nations are attacked because they disrupted cultures they came into contact with, yet they are the prime targets for the experimental monoculture which people expect would be feasible to maintain. All sorts of characters are trying to tear open Western societies and cultures and rearrange what's inside them as they please.
 
Sargeras said:
This reminds me of one of my Stormfront rants . . .





Let’s talk some more. Or you just listen and disagree, then deconstruct my post piece by piece in little quote boxes or something.

There are plenty of tangents in this post, so please watch your step.

How do you see the world today? How do you see it tomorrow? Will Africans still be starving? Will there be peace in the Middle East? Will we all love each other?

I turn on my television and I see all sorts of organizations clamor to give food to the starving African child. How long have they been doing that? Have there been any real results? Let’s talk about that. Let’s talk about the appeal to emotion that something can be done, simply because the gruesome alternative of mass starvation and bloody genocide perpetually tearing a continent apart is too horrible to accept as a very real possibility.

Is this wise? Should a tangible problem be approached with intangible emotionalism? "70 cents a day" hasn't done much.

IMHO, the charity helps to maintain the status quo of Africans not having any real clout in the world by giving the illusion that something can change, when there are undoubtedly forces working against that. After all, water finds its own level.

“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today. Teach a man to fish, and you have fed him for a lifetime.â€

People can claim there are various reasons for the general dismal situations that sub-Saharan African nations find themselves in. Let’s put the biological arguments aside, which I'm sure many antis have been exposed to. Why the sudden collapse of formerly prosperous African nations? Is it due to simple racism on the part of former colonial empires?

Before Europeans, what did Africans have, nation-wise? Were they much different from the Yanomami? What would happen if a group of colonists/administrators organized them into a single nation, and then simply up and left one day, leaving behind advanced technology and medicine?





http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yanomamo

How much do the Yanomami differ from the bygone Aztecs or Incas that they wouldn’t be able to recreate those pyramids and calendars? We know that intermittent contact with people higher on the ladder of civilization had severely disrupted the Yanomami way of life. Did this simply occur with sub-Saharan Africans, with a much larger gap between the groups of people which came into contact with each other?

This is something I find myself thinking to more and more, and which no one asks often. Were Africans culturally prepared take the reigns of an entity as massive as a nation? The citizens Pre-Columbian South American empires had literature, agriculture, cities, calenders. South America is far from obviously far from perfect. However, their civil wars are more along ideological lines, and not the wholesale slaughter and destitution we see and hear about in Africa. The bounderies of African nations look like a jigsaw puzzle. The true bounderies exist along tribal lines.

Many of the members of the civilized world take pride in their respective histories to the point where maintaining unity on a macroscopic scale, like a nation, becomes part of heritage. Africans do not have a comparable heritage, and I respect that it couldn’t be easy to be plopped down on the Earth and wander aimlessly, seeking solidarity based solely on skin color.

Blaming whites for the whole mess makes as much sense as pulling the cement out of a brick wall, and then blaming the cement for the collapse. Blaming whites for being there in the first place is just as pointless. Would the Arabs and northeast Asians be any more considerate to the 'free lunch' which Africa was?

Interestingly enough, I see that very reason cited for not pulling out of Iraq. People will blame whites for not helping Africans more, and for "helping" Iraqis too much. Damned either way.

What of the Middle East? I recall one nutjob anti claiming that Bush's selfless crusade to bring "democracy" to the Middle East is motivated by (you guessed it) racism.

If any of you are really informed of what's going on over there, then you would know how Israel can (and has) gotten away with practically everything. Either way, it is undeniable that there are many problems which plague the Middle East (I personally prefer the term 'symptom.') What's your 'anti' solution to them, contra to our nationalist thinking?

This goes back to the Realpolitik aspect of the world that is so largely ignored by ‘do-gooders.’ Think about it, antis. It has nothing to do with racism. If India were a First World nation, would it somehow be more inclined to donate food and money than Western nations to Africa because they associate with "brown pride?" I don’t think so. Ask yourself: What ‘sane’ and well-do-to nation would create more competition for itself on the global market?

The nations of the world are the result of macrocosmic evolution in which only the strong survived. They aren’t going to realistically ‘give it up.' They'll give aid to seem kind, and pull the wool over people's eyes to convince everyone that there is enough food for everyone, and that the problem boils down to the simple matter of 'getting the books in order.'

Just because we live in some sort of ‘enlightened’ age doesn’t mean the rules of the game have changed – they’ve only been given new names. Instead of “our financial interests in the region,†we hear “to promote peace and stability.â€

Do you think that if some sort of grand Red Revolution washed over the face of the Earth that there would be no more purges and dead people, no more competition and starving children?

I find it laughable when Western nations are attacked because they disrupted cultures they came into contact with, yet they are the prime targets for the experimental monoculture which people expect would be feasible to maintain. All sorts of characters are trying to tear open Western societies and cultures and rearrange what's inside them as they please.
Way too long, dude.
 
Sargeras said:
This reminds me of one of my Stormfront rants . . .





Let’s talk some more. Or you just listen and disagree, then deconstruct my post piece by piece in little quote boxes or something.

There are plenty of tangents in this post, so please watch your step.

How do you see the world today? How do you see it tomorrow? Will Africans still be starving? Will there be peace in the Middle East? Will we all love each other?

I turn on my television and I see all sorts of organizations clamor to give food to the starving African child. How long have they been doing that? Have there been any real results? Let’s talk about that. Let’s talk about the appeal to emotion that something can be done, simply because the gruesome alternative of mass starvation and bloody genocide perpetually tearing a continent apart is too horrible to accept as a very real possibility.

Is this wise? Should a tangible problem be approached with intangible emotionalism? "70 cents a day" hasn't done much.

IMHO, the charity helps to maintain the status quo of Africans not having any real clout in the world by giving the illusion that something can change, when there are undoubtedly forces working against that. After all, water finds its own level.

“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today. Teach a man to fish, and you have fed him for a lifetime.â€

People can claim there are various reasons for the general dismal situations that sub-Saharan African nations find themselves in. Let’s put the biological arguments aside, which I'm sure many antis have been exposed to. Why the sudden collapse of formerly prosperous African nations? Is it due to simple racism on the part of former colonial empires?

Before Europeans, what did Africans have, nation-wise? Were they much different from the Yanomami? What would happen if a group of colonists/administrators organized them into a single nation, and then simply up and left one day, leaving behind advanced technology and medicine?





http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yanomamo

How much do the Yanomami differ from the bygone Aztecs or Incas that they wouldn’t be able to recreate those pyramids and calendars? We know that intermittent contact with people higher on the ladder of civilization had severely disrupted the Yanomami way of life. Did this simply occur with sub-Saharan Africans, with a much larger gap between the groups of people which came into contact with each other?

This is something I find myself thinking to more and more, and which no one asks often. Were Africans culturally prepared take the reigns of an entity as massive as a nation? The citizens Pre-Columbian South American empires had literature, agriculture, cities, calenders. South America is far from obviously far from perfect. However, their civil wars are more along ideological lines, and not the wholesale slaughter and destitution we see and hear about in Africa. The bounderies of African nations look like a jigsaw puzzle. The true bounderies exist along tribal lines.

Many of the members of the civilized world take pride in their respective histories to the point where maintaining unity on a macroscopic scale, like a nation, becomes part of heritage. Africans do not have a comparable heritage, and I respect that it couldn’t be easy to be plopped down on the Earth and wander aimlessly, seeking solidarity based solely on skin color.

Blaming whites for the whole mess makes as much sense as pulling the cement out of a brick wall, and then blaming the cement for the collapse. Blaming whites for being there in the first place is just as pointless. Would the Arabs and northeast Asians be any more considerate to the 'free lunch' which Africa was?

Interestingly enough, I see that very reason cited for not pulling out of Iraq. People will blame whites for not helping Africans more, and for "helping" Iraqis too much. Damned either way.

What of the Middle East? I recall one nutjob anti claiming that Bush's selfless crusade to bring "democracy" to the Middle East is motivated by (you guessed it) racism.

If any of you are really informed of what's going on over there, then you would know how Israel can (and has) gotten away with practically everything. Either way, it is undeniable that there are many problems which plague the Middle East (I personally prefer the term 'symptom.') What's your 'anti' solution to them, contra to our nationalist thinking?

This goes back to the Realpolitik aspect of the world that is so largely ignored by ‘do-gooders.’ Think about it, antis. It has nothing to do with racism. If India were a First World nation, would it somehow be more inclined to donate food and money than Western nations to Africa because they associate with "brown pride?" I don’t think so. Ask yourself: What ‘sane’ and well-do-to nation would create more competition for itself on the global market?

The nations of the world are the result of macrocosmic evolution in which only the strong survived. They aren’t going to realistically ‘give it up.' They'll give aid to seem kind, and pull the wool over people's eyes to convince everyone that there is enough food for everyone, and that the problem boils down to the simple matter of 'getting the books in order.'

Just because we live in some sort of ‘enlightened’ age doesn’t mean the rules of the game have changed – they’ve only been given new names. Instead of “our financial interests in the region,†we hear “to promote peace and stability.â€

Do you think that if some sort of grand Red Revolution washed over the face of the Earth that there would be no more purges and dead people, no more competition and starving children?

I find it laughable when Western nations are attacked because they disrupted cultures they came into contact with, yet they are the prime targets for the experimental monoculture which people expect would be feasible to maintain. All sorts of characters are trying to tear open Western societies and cultures and rearrange what's inside them as they please.

So you're a "White Nationalist", are you kkk, neo-nazi or some more moderate SF er
 
Sendell said:
So you're a "White Nationalist", are you kkk, neo-nazi or some more moderate SF er
I don't like being among them, I'm not going to lie.

There has been a lot of untrue slander against the NAZIs and the KKK. For example, around 1 out of 8 people who were lynched when the KKK were first formed were white - they were against lawlessness, not simply "dem niggers." But that's not what bothers me about them.

What bothers me is their unflinching certainty that the swastika should rule over all of Europe. They may be right, but the issue is that they aren't willing to listen to the possibility that it might be wrong. Otherwise they'll accuse you of being kosher or whatever that's supposed to mean :roll:

No realistic person thinks there is going to be some war. But every person there (including me) believe that western, WHITE society is being torn open simply out of spite. It's typical leftist thinking. Whine whine whine and no real solutions. At least pinkos think they have some ultimate philosophy to things. Not so with your average leftist do-gooder who may be intelligent but is horribly misinformed about what actually happened throughout history.

I don't like terms like "moderate" because it places the divisions into factions which only argue amongst each other.

I have to be honest here. There are idiot half trolls who mess around with SF because they hate what they believe to be NAZIS. All they really do is make people paranoid as to which non racialist whites want to honestly discuss things.
 
Sargeras said:
It's under a DOS attack right now.



Free speech for all, except . . . when you don't like it.

Interesting, what's happening. I just visited but couldn't see anything wrong.
 
You can't reply to any threads. I've learned in the Sustaining Member forum that SF has been under a much better organized attack from Eastern Europe, mostly Poland.
 
Sargeras said:
You can't reply to any threads. I've learned in the Sustaining Member forum that SF has been under a much better organized attack from Eastern Europe, mostly Poland.

Can't say I'm particularly upset. Stormfront is the kind of place that can cause real harm to people.
 
Sargeras said:
Sure. How?
It supports the ideologies of groups that hurt people and fuels their fanaticism. It's sort of like those islamic cleric lunatics calling for the destruction of the western world. They don't personally kill people but they encourage others to do harm.
 
Sendell said:
It supports the ideologies of groups that hurt people and fuels their fanaticism.
So what? Palestinians are considered terrorists. I look at them as freedom fighters.

Communism has hurt more people that NAZIism. Why aren't you preaching on a South American forum, Sendell?
It's sort of like those islamic cleric lunatics calling for the destruction of the western world. They don't personally kill people but they encourage others to do harm.
Also various "terrorist groups" have stated that their problems are not with the American people - they are with the American government. They made a big point of making a distinction too. Before the Western world started to support Israel, we had no enemies in the Middle East. Why aren't they killing Buddhists, Sendell? Why do they focus on the west when there are plenty of infidels to the east?
 
Sendell said:
They don't personally kill people but they encourage others to do harm.
Maybe if you tried to read some of the stuff instead of just looking at the avatars you would know what it's really all about.
 
Sargeras said:
Maybe if you tried to read some of the stuff instead of just looking at the avatars you would know what it's really all about.

The thing was founded by Don Black, the ex-KKK Grand Fucknut, ex-American Nazi Party Member who tried to invade Dominica.

If it's not about racist violence then what the hell is it all about Sargeras?
 
Sendell said:
The thing was founded by Don Black, the ex-KKK Grand Fucknut, ex-American Nazi Party Member who tried to invade Dominica.

If it's not about racist violence then what the hell is it all about Sargeras?
It's all about clumsy strawmen, Sendell. Because Don Black is the admin, it invalidates the total belief system of white nations being for white people, of France being for the French, of Germany for Germans, and Poland for the Polish? What sort of uproar would their be if we demanded the Japanese open up their borders and loosen their immigration policies? Because you won't be able to live their anytime soon, Sendell. Unless you're a jap.

How's that for racism? OMGLOLBBQ

Don Black has stated that the image of the KKK as being a murderous group of thugs cannot be erased, and thus he no longer associates with them. I don't care either way because there are plenty of scum within the White Nationalist movement which give it a bad name and it doesn't make a difference to me if he is one of them or isn't.


If you have any real opposition to the tenets of WN, then please state them.

In fact, I'll give you one more and post some:



CONCERNING WHITE NATIONALIST STRATEGY TOWARD OTHER RACES.



Proposition zero. White Nationalists intend to coexist peacefully with, and separately from, other races



Proposition one. Members of other races shall not be permitted to reside in White Homelands, even peacefully. Persistent incursions shall be considered an act of war.

(like the Mexican army spics who make continuous incursions into United States territory and attack Minutemen and border guard with heavy machine guns to assist the drug smuggling spics but which leftist pieces of shit media people won't mention)

Proposition two. White Nationalists shall not encroach upon the Homelands of other races.

Proposition three. White Nationalists may trade knowledge and goods with other races, or may refuse to so trade, as they see fit.

Proposition four. Other races who do not encroach upon White Homelands shall be treated with justice and courtesy.



Proposition five. White Nationalists shall sincerely strive to avoid or resolve conflicts between Whites and other races, so long as those conflicts are not caused by incursion upon White Homelands.


Comment: Whites are not to interfere in conflicts between third parties



Proposition six. All White Nationalists everywhere are obliged to aid in the expulsion of other races from a White Homeland, even if they do not reside in that Homeland.

How fucking unreasonable is that? It's a pretty fucking longshot if your white, because we can't dance, we are oppressors, and our babies be deserved to be impaled on spikes. If we even speak of an ALL-WHITE place to live, it is UNACCEPTABLE. We MUST FORCE OURSELVES to question our entire culture and existence in front of a tribunal of brown-skins who have been led to believe that ALL their problems have been caused by whites.
 
Why aren't you preaching on a South American forum, Sendell?

"Sendell: Will reply tomorrow."

Well, well. It seems that some people are too sure of themselves, eh lefty? I fucking double dare you to give me your worst, because that's all it's known for being.
 
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