Are there really aliens?

[HEX]

Judging from whats going on here on Earth I would say there surely is life throughout the star systems. Evidence for biological processes on Earth date back to between 3.8 to 4.2 billion years... the planet itself is thought to be about 4.8 billion years old. Seems like shortly after the Earth cooled enough to sustain a crust layer, life got going. But we must keep in mind that the majority of that time between then and now, the majority of life on Earth was and still is microbial. So the chances for there to exists advanced civilizations below the ice of Europa may be slim but the potential for them to occur now or at some point exists. As for aliens visiting Earth now... all I can say is that I have seen some-things in the sky that didn't look like it came from any of the local airports or military base that Im aware of.

 

[Tyrant]

Since you dont understand what I said, its reasonable that you would believe a crock of pseudoscience like Dilation. The experiement was nothing more than using gravity in the same fashion as throwing GUNK inside the watch to make is slow down! That flimsy experiement proved nothing except the already know fact that gravity has an effect on matter and can increase an objects inertia!

They used atomic clocks, you idiot.

It was no secret that it would have happened. I have seen mear lawn prinklers cause a gravity field strong enough to move a sensitive meausring device. It also means that placing a watch in a different gravity field and its gears would move faster or slower depeding upon increase or decrease in gravity! I bet you if they had the balls to use digital, metal, plastic, and lead gear watches their data would not match up at all and show the crock of shit their experiement was!

Oh, kid. :roll:

your the one that said there were NO EXCEPTIONS! I do believe that there are objects capable of moving faster than light speed. Especially if God proves to exist when the end comes. The shear size of space would dictate that God has a power to manipulate things far beyond the speed of light!

LOL! This has got to be a troll. It's somewhat clever because not many people here are likely to really understand the nonsense you are spewing, but kudos either way.

Other than my believe I cannot prove things move faster than light. I can only quote THEORY that contradicts YOUR Theory. I am not the one slapping around the NO EXCEPTIONS clause like I have omniscience.

Matter cannot move at the speed of light, and nothing can exceed it. No exceptions.

Prove that it does. Its nice that you... the only person on the planet seems to know this because you, the only person on the planet who can identify and measure the physical arm of gravity. We measure gravity by its effects! We have not seen nor can we measure the power source behind gravity! We only know its there and its got a serious relationship to mass and plasma!

;;lk;lpopo';'pl'pll'p'plpl'['pl['pl'pl

Dude... your using theories like they are fucking Facts! 1st sign of a pseudoscience shithead! That is where you got your gravity moves at the speed of light bullshit from!

But it does. The effect may seem to be instantaneuos because the curve in spacetime (Or graviton emissions, take your pick) are already present when an object gets close to another and is influenced by the gravity.

If time is a reality then infinite matter/energy must be able to reside at every single point in the universe!

Where you drunk when you wrote this?

Every miniscule nano, macro, microscopic change in the universe would be saved in state just like a computer taking a snapshot of your WHOLE hard drive each time a bit changes. Now maybe your puny intellect can begin to understand the fallicy in most of your theories!

I can explain them in greater detail, kid. You've done nothing more than clumsily explain your intuition without even bothering to understand the concepts I'm talking about.

And you call me a psuedoscience believer! Perhaps next you'll tell me that angels can move faster than light! :lol:

I am beyond your pathetic understanding of physics because you fail to account for the obvious!

 

[Astral]

They used atomic clocks, you idiot.

I see you failed to understand what I asked. I want comparisons to several different kinds. I know that atomic clocks should be the most acurate we have to offer but like I said! They still operate of a prinicpal of a gear mechanism.. even if its the atom. If you apply more gravity to an object.. including an atom you change it behaviour. Like I said... time dilation proves nothing and is no different than throwing mud into a standard gear driven watch to prove the theory! I can't help your too low brow to fathom this!

Oh, kid. :roll:

Whats wrong? nothing to say about it? Feeling threatened?

LOL! This has got to be a troll. It's somewhat clever because not many people here are likely to really understand the nonsense you are spewing, but kudos either way.

This is no troll. I am dead serious! You are just trying to hide that giant foot in your mouth!

Matter cannot move at the speed of light, and nothing can exceed it. No exceptions.

You dont know that. Same was said about sound. While I will agree initially it does not appear that breaking the speed of light conventionally is acchievable I will say that there may be no limits to speed. You no anyone on this planet can know this. And to grandstand this claim without proof just shows how much of an assnine pseudoscientist you are!

;;lk;lpopo';'pl'pll'p'plpl'['pl['pl'pl

losing your mind or just your grasp of the conversation?

But it does. The effect may seem to be instantaneuos because the curve in spacetime (Or graviton emissions, take your pick) are already present when an object gets close to another and is influenced by the gravity.

Once again... you fail to provide reasonable evidence for anything. A curve in spacetime? Please those curves are nothing more than physical objects being tethered in a sense by a physical force. You claim is just like saying I am curving spacetime when I wrap a car around a tree! You have missed the stupidity behind curvature! You guys are explaning physical events backwards and building theories that WILL NOT pan out on them! When you fall on your face I will be laughing my ass all the way off. Then I am going to laugh some more for you being a stupid idiot for believing it!

Where you drunk when you wrote this?

I do not drink, nor have I ever been drunk. The simple fact that you cannot comprehend the concept of my remark and how it plays a role in this discussion further indicates that you are only talking out your ass. You quote others research but you dont undersand any of it! Is it better to know that 1+1=2 or is it better to know why 1+1=2. You only know that 1+1=2... I KNOW WHY it does!

I can explain them in greater detail, kid. You've done nothing more than clumsily explain your intuition without even bothering to understand the concepts I'm talking about.

This is where my infinite matter/energy at every point comes into play. And your too stupid to have noticed! I completely understand the concepts you are regurgitating. I am telling you THEY ARE WRONG! You dont even have the fundamental knowledge to fully comprehend it. You see einstein as a groundbreaking scientist... I see him as a fucking lunatic who often failed to understand the obvious. He completely ignored them on many occassions. And in many cases failed to make the obersvation that light(ening) is not constant! Because of that his theory of relativity is shot to HELL! Retards like you are just to brainwashed like the religous fundies to step away from it because far to many of your OTHER theories are built upon them! And in your hubris you just cant except that you got it wrong!

And you call me a psuedoscience believer! Perhaps next you'll tell me that angels can move faster than light! :lol:

I dont know if they can or cannot. If they can great, and if not, then so be it! I am not the one in this thread acting like I KNOW things I cannot possibly know... things such as speed limits!

Ha ha ha! Mwuhahahahahahaa!

 

[Tyrant]

I see you failed to understand what I asked. I want comparisons to several different kinds. I know that atomic clocks should be the most acurate we have to offer but like I said! They still operate of a prinicpal of a gear mechanism.. even if its the atom. If you apply more gravity to an object.. including an atom you change it behaviour. Like I said... time dilation proves nothing and is no different than throwing mud into a standard gear driven watch to prove the theory!

Pound, Rebka in 1959 measured the gravitational red shift of light as it is emitted at a lower height in the Earth's gravitational field. The results were within 10% of general relativity. Later Pound and Snider (in 1964) improved this to 1%. This effect is fully accounted for by gravitational time dilation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_dilation



Kopeikin and Fomalont concluded that the speed of gravity is between 0.8 and 1.2 times the speed of light, which would be fully consistent with the theoretical prediction of general relativity that the speed of gravity is exactly the same as the speed of light.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_gravity
^Perhaps Sergei Kopeikin is wrong? I think we should find a forum he frequents... you could tell him all about your ideas.

I can't help your too low brow to fathom this!

Why don't you look at your first post in this thread before accusing others of being lowbrow?

This is no troll. I am dead serious!

Fine, I'll bite.

You dont know that. Same was said about sound.

This is exactly the wrong type of thinking. There are no 'categories' of speed barriers that have to somehow be broken, that there is some central theme of a speed barrier, our technological prowess, and a way to break the barrier.

For example, the speed of sound varies in the medium it travels. As you stated that there is no giant grandfather-clock in the sky that records everything, there is no 'set of speed barriers.' We just went really fast, getting their gradually, and happened to go faster than sound.

While I will agree initially it does not appear that breaking the speed of light conventionally is acchievable I will say that there may be no limits to speed.

I think you should read about Planck units.

As distance is linked to velocity, it would be impossible to traverse everything traversable in less than a unit of Planck time (the smallest possible measurable unit of time.)

Remember, the universe functions in relation to everything in it. Something travelling at infinite speed would simply disappear, as it wouldn't interact with anything.

You no anyone on this planet can know this.

You're really hung up on this 'absolute knowledge' stuff, aren't you?

How do you know stars aren't a government conspiracy? Have you touched one?

And to grandstand this claim without proof just shows how much of an assnine pseudoscientist you are!

All laughter aside, I am prepared to back anything up. Let's move away from the name-calling and debating about debating; ask me something specific.

Once again... you fail to provide reasonable evidence for anything. A curve in spacetime?

Please those curves are nothing more than physical objects being tethered in a sense by a physical force.

And this physical force happens to be a curve or indentation on a 2-dimensional area. Are perhaps you are suggesting that space is a physical object?

You claim is just like saying I am curving spacetime when I wrap a car around a tree!

No, totally off base.

You have missed the stupidity behind curvature! You guys are explaning physical events backwards and building theories that WILL NOT pan out on them! When you fall on your face I will be laughing my ass all the way off. Then I am going to laugh some more for you being a stupid idiot for believing it!

I do not drink, nor have I ever been drunk. The simple fact that you cannot comprehend the concept of my remark and how it plays a role in this discussion further indicates that you are only talking out your ass. You quote others research but you dont undersand any of it! Is it better to know that 1+1=2 or is it better to know why 1+1=2. You only know that 1+1=2... I KNOW WHY it does!

More bandwidth-wasting crap.

This is where my infinite matter/energy at every point comes into play. And your too stupid to have noticed! I completely understand the concepts you are regurgitating. I am telling you THEY ARE WRONG! You dont even have the fundamental knowledge to fully comprehend it. You see einstein as a groundbreaking scientist... I see him as a fucking lunatic who often failed to understand the obvious. He completely ignored them on many occassions. And in many cases failed to make the obersvation that light(ening) is not constant! Because of that his theory of relativity is shot to HELL! Retards like you are just to brainwashed like the religous fundies to step away from it because far to many of your OTHER theories are built upon them! And in your hubris you just cant except that you got it wrong!

So sure that I have it wrong? But, how can you know for certain I have it wrong!??! You ooze of self-certainty and hubris, good sir!

Might I suggest one of these?

I dont know if they can or cannot. If they can great, and if not, then so be it! I am not the one in this thread acting like I KNOW things I cannot possibly know... things such as speed limits!

I am guilty of doing nothing more than what countless others have before me, in extrapolating conclusions from data, and of not having my head up in the clouds.

Oh, and the concept time travel is utter bullshit, yes.

Ha ha ha! Mwuhahahahahahaa!

All in all, it is a shame, in my mind, that so many peoples' minds are polluted by fantasy these days (And I don't mean this as a specific poke at yourself.)

You see, A Karas started this thread in pursuit of knowledge, whereas you simply wanted to rant and rave about what you think, nay, would like reality to look like.

 

[Astral]

Pound, Rebka in 1959 measured the gravitational red shift of light as it is emitted at a lower height in the Earth's gravitational field. The results were within 10% of general relativity. Later Pound and Snider (in 1964) improved this to 1%. This effect is fully accounted for by gravitational time dilation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_dilation


Kopeikin and Fomalont concluded that the speed of gravity is between 0.8 and 1.2 times the speed of light, which would be fully consistent with the theoretical prediction of general relativity that the speed of gravity is exactly the same as the speed of light.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_gravity
^Perhaps Sergei Kopeikin is wrong? I think we should find a forum he frequents... you could tell him all about your ideas.

I have already seen enough of the research on time dilation to call its BS. Its a simple matter of common sense you consistantly piss out the window. There has never been any misuderstandings that gravity effects everything on a physical scale. Because of this fact, it tells you right off the bat that it is not possible to test true dilation out unless you can extricate yourself from this plane... and its not possible to extricate yourself from a plane and still test it or interact with it. In the most miniscule way no matter how unintending you are in order to measure something it has to hit something thereby starting the chain reaction of ruining the validity of an experiment of this scope. Time is only a concept and not a reality. Once you get that we can bridge this divide that keeps you bound like a slave to your theories.

On Mr Sergei... I would only ask one thing. Can he identify the actual physical arm of gravity? Can he tell me the true source of power behind gravity? Until then... he can only capitulate. Because he cannot prove shit until otherwise and neither can you. You are only regurgitating Theory... yet you preach these theories just as the religous fundies of old preached a flat earth and with equal hubris and stupidity! I have made no claims to the real speed of gravity... I am only said what you propose is not proven. It may be possible that gravity is limited to light speed... but I am not dumb enough to hinge my research and theories not something I have no proof of! I know your from the brand of half ass science section that likes to take the part of the research you like and toss the rest. Your kind also likes research that is biased... as in formed in a method that will lean towards your Theory... you have no real interest in truth.. only to think one up and do the work to make it appear to be the thruth like a Magician in a show!

Why don't you look at your first post in this thread before accusing others of being lowbrow?

I will admit I am a coarse aggressive person here. I offer appologies for being a general ass. But I am still correct!

Fine, I'll bite.

This is exactly the wrong type of thinking. There are no 'categories' of speed barriers that have to somehow be broken, that there is some central theme of a speed barrier, our technological prowess, and a way to break the barrier.

For example, the speed of sound varies in the medium it travels. As you stated that there is no giant grandfather-clock in the sky that records everything, there is no 'set of speed barriers.' We just went really fast, getting their gradually, and happened to go faster than sound.

How is the thinking wrong? Because I refuse to admit defeat with there is no proof of it? With scientists like you running around we never would have broken the sound barrier. I will agree with your point on just because the barrier is there its meant to be broken. However, just because its there also does not mean it cant be broken! Now, about the variability of the speed of sound depending upon the medium... same goes for light. We have no true vacuum to test the full speed of light in. what if gravity, and particles, intertia could be completely eliminated? would light travel even faster? We have a good determination of light speed already. It does look like its almost at its limit!

Now here is the kicker. if there is an energy that does travel faster than light... we could not measure it... why because our machines would not be fast enough to measure it! We are still limited and I for one will not forget about limitations untill we live forever of our own genious!

I think you should read about Planck units.

As distance is linked to velocity, it would be impossible to traverse everything traversable in less than a unit of Planck time (the smallest possible measurable unit of time.)

Remember, the universe functions in relation to everything in it. Something travelling at infinite speed would simply disappear, as it wouldn't interact with anything.

Um... if planck is correct, then there really is a giant grandfather clock swinging in the heavens... think about it. You agreed that there was not. which is it? Time is a measured constant in planck's theory/unit system. Now dont go and contradict yourself. Your losing track of your own theories now.

You're really hung up on this 'absolute knowledge' stuff, aren't you?

How do you know stars aren't a government conspiracy? Have you touched one?[/quote]

let me rephrase. not absolute... it was meant to be understood that right now, with our technical capablities and knowledge we cannot know. Not that we will never know... which still may be the case. But right now? Its the way it is.

And the comment on gubermint conspiracies... ha ha... funny.

All laughter aside, I am prepared to back anything up. Let's move away from the name-calling and debating about debating; ask me something specific.

And that is where differ greatly. You can try to back it up all you want. I want proof of your grand standing claims. And you have yet to provide it. You want to talk and be reasonable try actually being reasonable for a change. Your not being reasonable at all. Your spitting theory out without much proof or evidence for the most part and expecting me to believe on Faith. I never believe in mankind on faith... you can forget that one right now! It is well documented on how far a man will lie to advance his pseudoscience! I am mearly saying that by the way your acting about it that you have fallen prey! You need to start backing down and realize that those are just theories. Some seem sound but like most of them because of their need to explain time as a force of reality they always fall short in my book. Until they start using time as only a tool like math I will never have respect for their blatant blindness. Furthermore they will never get it right either!

And this physical force happens to be a curve or indentation on a 2-dimensional area. Are perhaps you are suggesting that space is a physical object?


No, totally off base.



More bandwidth-wasting crap.

Heh... this topic spans so many different issues it not really funny. #1. there is no REAL curve in space. It is conceptual just like time! But here we go again with you guys taking to to far again! That picture is only a laymans representation of the effect of gravity. We all know that if they put tethers on the objects it would cause more frustration with idiots but the fact remians that "The Curve" being over played is begining to damage reasonable theoretic science. The only curve is an object passing by someting and its physical attraction altering its course. Thats where your curve comes in. But not only did they fail to respect what a simple thing like curve is they went and applied time to it! Dammit, curve is ok so long as it is respected in the proper light! it is only the natural tethering of gravitational forces... and by consistantly thinking in curves you are only warping the REAL perception of space. In so many ways you guys tell everyone else they are closed minded but the first thing you scientists do is start applying limited attributes like 2d frame objects to explaining theories! This is more of a gripe so disregard that last sentence.

So there is no real curve in space, but a term bandied about to explain gravitational effects. However.... like I said... they had to slap time onto it... they slap time onto everything. Its like a bad fad that just wont fucking die!
I am saying... that until they rid themselves of treating time as a reality they will NEVER get anything right!

So sure that I have it wrong? But, how can you know for certain I have it wrong!??! You ooze of self-certainty and hubris, good sir!

Might I suggest one of these?

Try not to count my disdain for your grandstanding remarks as hubris. I am not the one making claims that I cannot know. The tin foil hat is for conspiracies and alien mind probes. I fail to see how you could apply this to a discussion on theories that are applicable to the physical universe not on some political event!

I am guilty of doing nothing more than what countless others have before me, in extrapolating conclusions from data, and of not having my head up in the clouds.

Oh, and the concept time travel is utter bullshit, yes.

Concepts cant be bullshit. For they do not have to be grounded in FACT! They can be just as untrue as a bald face lie! However this does not remove them from the realm of concept. Your syntax is in error! At some point your head is in the clouds. When you fail to bring yourself down and account for the mundane bare and essential common sense of things you have lost yourself! And indeed your noggin is up in the clouds!

All in all, it is a shame, in my mind, that so many peoples' minds are polluted by fantasy these days (And I don't mean this as a specific poke at yourself.)

You see, A Karas started this thread in pursuit of knowledge, whereas you simply wanted to rant and rave about what you think, nay, would like reality to look like.

Part of the pursuit of knowledge is to get rid of all the bullshit that is flying around. If you look at history and much of our society, you will invariably find and most of our life is based on lies and untruth. You said it was a shame right? Well I can only agree with you there.
We must seperate the lies from the truth, and we must weigh with a steady mind, one capable of understanding the workings of the logics that are presented. Science is not all about upper echelon of bullshit day dreaming. At the end of the day the simple things rule you! And forgetting about such simple things in those theories are what devestats them.

Even though almost all of einsteins theory of relativity has been blasted to hell and back it is still bandied around. Why? Can you explain that? One of its founding principles... light being constant, has already been destroyed!

Because of this and your behaviour, much of todays science is nothing more than a religious. A religous organization that is dogmatically on par with the Church! It does not matter what is real, truth, or sound.... its now just who that is respectable in the community and what they declare. The search for truth in science has pretty much taken a back seat to dogma! And you know it!

 

[Tyrant]

Time is only a concept and not a reality.

I think it's time to make a distinction here. It might save us some trouble:

I believe that two 'forms' of time exist. One is the reaction of matter and energy to the forces holding the universe together. For instance, how quickly an electron will orbit an atomic nucleus in relation to an outside observer, molecular reactions, all translating into how quickly one would age and how quickly 'time' (Observable, relevant sense) would pass.

The other is a sort of a non-observable 'absolute time,' which would be completely free of any influence. I don't buy the notion that within a Big Crunch/Final Singularity time would cease to be simply because no matter in the universe could function as it did before.

Simple because no clock would exist doesn't mean time wouldn't pass, just as a tree falling in the forest with no one around to hear it doesn't mean it wouldn't make a sound.

On Mr Sergei... I would only ask one thing. Can he identify the actual physical arm of gravity? Can he tell me the true source of power behind gravity? Until then... he can only capitulate. Because he cannot prove shit until otherwise and neither can you.

The source of gravity is totally irrelavant. What's important is that it affects everything. Nothing can escape it, so it makes no difference if it's described as a curve in spacetime or not.

I will admit I am a coarse aggressive person here. I offer appologies for being a general ass.

No problem, then.

We have no true vacuum to test the full speed of light in.

You misunderstand - 186,000mps is the speed of light in a vacuum.

what if gravity, and particles, intertia could be completely eliminated? would light travel even faster? We have a good determination of light speed already. It does look like its almost at its limit!

It couldn't be observed in any sense because the way matter and energy function is tied to the speed of light.

In all frames of reference, the speed of light is constant. Two observers travelling towards each other at 51% of the speed of light will not see the other approaching at 102% the speed of light.

Now here is the kicker. if there is an energy that does travel faster than light... we could not measure it... why because our machines would not be fast enough to measure it!

Sure they could. We could position sensors miles way, and see if a signal of superluminal speed would reflect off one and arrive at the other FTL.

Um... if planck is correct,

This is fundamental knowledge which have been long-established. If you praise the genius of humanity, why can't you praise what we have so far?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planck_length

I suggest you read under 'Significance.'


Or here is one better:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planck_time

Planck time is the smallest possible unit of time. Anything smaller would be meaningless, because somehow recording the universe and comparing t = 0 to t = 1/2 would yield an identical state.

The Planck time is the time it would take a photon travelling at the speed of light to cross a distance equal to the Planck length, and is thus considered to be a "quantum of time".

Do you see how this all fits in with other theories? The manipulations you describe are impossible because they would require us to make use of building blocks which do not exist.

Imagine the universe as a grid, with blocks representing Planck lengths. How could we cut a block into two pieces if all we have available are blocks of the same size?

Sure, it's possible to imagine 1/2 a Planck unit, but because any smaller unit bears no meaning and is simply not present in the machinations of existence, it is simply not possible to alter reality any further.

then there really is a giant grandfather clock swinging in the heavens... think about it. You agreed that there was not. which is it? Time is a measured constant in planck's theory/unit system. Now dont go and contradict yourself. Your losing track of your own theories now.

That was in the context of time travel/dilation.

let me rephrase. not absolute... it was meant to be understood that right now, with our technical capablities and knowledge we cannot know.

We don't have to be in some Star Trek epoch to understand these concepts.

Not that we will never know... which still may be the case.

I agree. There still exist no really satisfactory TOE.

And that is where differ greatly. You can try to back it up all you want. I want proof of your grand standing claims. And you have yet to provide it. You want to talk and be reasonable try actually being reasonable for a change. Your not being reasonable at all.

Whatever.

Your spitting theory out without much proof or evidence for the most part and expecting me to believe on Faith.

Nonsense. Just as me about something straight up, and I'll do my best.

I never believe in mankind on faith... you can forget that one right now! It is well documented on how far a man will lie to advance his pseudoscience! I am mearly saying that by the way your acting about it that you have fallen prey!

I can understand how you might believe that. Well not really, since you seem dead set on not first disproving the architectures of reality I am presenting you with.

Heh... this topic spans so many different issues it not really funny. #1. there is no REAL curve in space. It is conceptual just like time!

Gravity affects everything in a curve. It is there, for all intents and purposes.

So there is no real curve in space, but a term bandied about to explain gravitational effects. However.... like I said... they had to slap time onto it... they slap time onto everything. Its like a bad fad that just wont fucking die!

I like that.

Some quantum physics are like that. Band-aid after band-aid. Look at string theory, for fuck's sake.

Concepts cant be bullshit. For they do not have to be grounded in FACT! They can be just as untrue as a bald face lie! However this does not remove them from the realm of concept. Your syntax is in error! At some point your head is in the clouds. When you fail to bring yourself down and account for the mundane bare and essential common sense of things you have lost yourself! And indeed your noggin is up in the clouds!

So you do believe in time travel, or are you simply taking up a contrary and hard-line position just to be twat?

Science is not all about upper echelon of bullshit day dreaming.

That's exactly what you've been doing! I'm attempting to be realistic here, while you're talking about faster than light travel!

Even though almost all of einsteins theory of relativity has been blasted to hell and back it is still bandied around. Why? Can you explain that? One of its founding principles... light being constant, has already been destroyed!

No, the speed of light is constant to the observer.

In fact, Relativity explains many things so well that scientists are struggling to make it, and Quantum Mechanics compatable. If one were as flawed as you attempt to make it out to be, it would be discarded.

Because of this and your behaviour, much of todays science is nothing more than a religious. A religous organization that is dogmatically on par with the Church! It does not matter what is real, truth, or sound.... its now just who that is respectable in the community and what they declare. The search for truth in science has pretty much taken a back seat to dogma! And you know it!

Maybe the Big Bang is just religion disguised as science, but that's pretty much where the buck stops.

OF COURSE THINGS CAN GO FASTER THAN LIGHT. ASK HIM ABOUT TACHYONS.

What about tachyons? Have you captured any in a jar? Stop selectively choosing those theoretical concepts which suit your whims best, and discarding established science, you fucking twat.

 

[Astral]

ok. I am going to stop the reply game. Our posts are getting out of hand now. I will try to bring some general cohesion back as best I can.

Some primary points. At first you agreed that there was nothing controling time, and yet you brought up planck's theory and then you supported it. If his theory is correct then there is a control to time. Unfortunately he just like all the other chumps in science never fully explain it leaving a big gaping hole in their theory. This control also stipulates that time travel is possible provided that we found a way to manipulate this control.

Also on FTL. it does not matter how far away an object is from a point of origin. The simple fact is that the matter/energy would still be traveling too fast for said object/device to properly register/sense/detect it! The object would require FTL processing/sensing in order to yeild intelligable results!

Another point on FTL. As one of my favorite nut scientists stated. FTL travel is possible if we can create a giant gravity generator and collapse 2 points in space onto each other. Have a ship cross that divide and turn off the machine thus snaping ship and that space half a galaxy away in say a couple seconds. Plenty FTL if you ask me. My only problem with the theory was the initial creation of this gravity well. I dont think it would just snap back like nothing happened! I believe a blackhole instead would be generated and that would suck ass in our little corner of the galaxy!

I also like the fact that you dont seem to agree with the tachyon theories. Why not? just because they go against your little dogma on FTL not being possible? Do they somehow break your model of existance up?

Let me straighten some things out about this whole thread! YOUR the one being completely unreasonable. You are talking about most of your theories as if they are fact and we should just be happy with the evidence you have provided. Yet we are not and you still have not found proof! There are some respectable parts about the theories you have provided yet their "Time" parts are deal breakers for me. Because of the introduction of time in a very bad light, the theories will never fully work out. I want something that works all the way. Not half-ass. If you are comfortable with half-ass, then by all means be comfortable. Just dont expect someone with higher expectations to visit at your level!

You got all insulted because I asked for proof of your theories and then you turn around can ask for proof in a jar about tachyons. The theory on tachs are just as sound a planks, time dilation, and the others! THEY ARE ALL FUCKING THEORIES! Once I can get you accept that and behave and discuse things on this order then we can get somewhere! But first... you need to get off the science pulpit and stop preaching your favorite theories as facts!

#1. You have to prove time actualy exists. I think time does not exist in any fashion as these theories you have mentioned say it does. I see time in the intellectual equivilent of math. Both are consepts. Each one taught, and no partical matter/energy enforces each others rules! Time is just like math, a CONCEPT we use to measure the change in states of matter/energy in a way we can understand things! Something to HELP put things into perspective.

#2. If time does exist there MUST be a control mechanism. It could be planck time, nuclear time, string, blah blah blah or blah! But the simple fact is, If time is real, then it can be traveled! We only need a mechanism for it! Of course this also means that past, present, and future must all exist at the same time. This is where the infinite matter/energy at every point in space comes into play! I know most people cant seem to grasp the depth of this because their miniscule intellect cannot bridge the gap out of this here and now attitude! You like everyone else lives with the assumption that ours is the ONLY reality here. You may be dead ass wrong, and yet your pathetic theories turn a blind eye! Take for example if any one of the religions here are Earth are true. All it takes is for just about any one of them to be true. Guess what? We now have to get science to contend with multi dimensional energy/time, and physics. Not to mention the fact that part of the controls on these are FTL manipulations of existance! Now does that not just put a fucking kink into things? Here we are traveling along in our own little exsistence having a party and something wholey beyond reality comes and rears its ugly head because we are too short sighted to (and I hate this cliche) think outside our box! Call it aliens, call it spirits, call it what ever you want. We have more than enough ancient and current phenomena that appear around earth! I dont think science is up to the task. Why? because science has turned into a religion. And now that it has dogmatic foundations in certain theories, like einsteins, and a few others it has become corrupt. People like you have declared some of these "Unproven" theories as corner stones to our physical plane. And you dont like anything that comes along to debunk your claims. Guess what! If something comes along to debunk, you should be to the first to accept it! Its the tenet of science to review and find the truth of things. Lately science has only been conducted in biased fashion to only do one thing! Help prove or provide evidence to support that persons claim. It is rarely conducted to actually find the truth! The contrary research is thusly thrown in the trash!

he he... what do you think of that? I dont mind your theories in certain aspects. I just have this enormous put off about time and you theories erronious concept of it. Until they get time right... screw them. Why? because I cant have any respect for a bunch of whack jobs too stupid to understand what time "really" is! Who is the one short on brain power? It is not I! Especially when I am the one left asking for more! I see beyond their pathetic veils!

 

[Tyrant]

ok. I am going to stop the reply game. Our posts are getting out of hand now. I will try to bring some general cohesion back as best I can.

Thanks.

Some primary points. At first you agreed that there was nothing controling time, and yet you brought up planck's theory and then you supported it. If his theory is correct then there is a control to time. Unfortunately he just like all the other chumps in science never fully explain it leaving a big gaping hole in their theory. This control also stipulates that time travel is possible provided that we found a way to manipulate this control.

You missed the point. Planck units are meant to demonstrate the most natural, basic intervals at which everything in the cosmos moves, how far, what energy level, etc. It doesn't make time travel more or less possible. It's simply a baseline for how the universe functions.

Here is an example: Have you ever seen Conway's 'Game of Life' ?

1. # Any live cell with fewer than two neighbours dies, as if by loneliness.
2. # Any live cell with more than three neighbours dies, as if by overcrowding.
3. # Any live cell with two or three neighbours lives, unchanged, to the next generation.
4. # Any dead cell with exactly three neighbours comes to life.

(Pardon me if you are familiar with it)

Now you can make some interesting things with it. It has been proven that you could make very advanced computing, also it would require trillions upon trillions of pixels.

Someone even designed a Turing Machine:

http://www.cs.ualberta.ca/~bulitko/F02/papers/tm_words.pdf


But the cells are always bound by the grid limitations.

Our universe is the same. Now how would we be able to even detect 'half a block' or Planck length? By how it interacts with other blocks. But anything less than a Planck length isn't required for the universe to function.

Also on FTL. it does not matter how far away an object is from a point of origin. The simple fact is that the matter/energy would still be traveling too fast for said object/device to properly register/sense/detect it! The object would require FTL processing/sensing in order to yeild intelligable results!

I don't see what you mean here. All a computer system would need is to be able to detect it somehow by optical or energy level gauging means. It has nothing to do with how fast it can process information.


What I proposed was similar to this:

Another point on FTL. As one of my favorite nut scientists stated. FTL travel is possible if we can create a giant gravity generator and collapse 2 points in space onto each other. Have a ship cross that divide and turn off the machine thus snaping ship and that space half a galaxy away in say a couple seconds. Plenty FTL if you ask me. My only problem with the theory was the initial creation of this gravity well. I dont think it would just snap back like nothing happened! I believe a blackhole instead would be generated and that would suck ass in our little corner of the galaxy!

It would be crossing more distance than light would, yes. But ideas like that are much more mathematical than anything else, and they rely on that dirty little word you hate: spacetime.

I also like the fact that you dont seem to agree with the tachyon theories. Why not? just because they go against your little dogma on FTL not being possible? Do they somehow break your model of existance up?

I don't know any Tachyons personally, but I could be friends with them if they existed on more than paper.

They are possibilities, but then again, so is time travel.

Let me straighten some things out about this whole thread! YOUR the one being completely unreasonable. You are talking about most of your theories as if they are fact and we should just be happy with the evidence you have provided. Yet we are not and you still have not found proof! There are some respectable parts about the theories you have provided yet their "Time" parts are deal breakers for me. Because of the introduction of time in a very bad light, the theories will never fully work out. I want something that works all the way. Not half-ass. If you are comfortable with half-ass, then by all means be comfortable. Just dont expect someone with higher expectations to visit at your level!

I don't expect many to visit my level. But I'm always willing to give them a hand.

You got all insulted because I asked for proof of your theories and then you turn around can ask for proof in a jar about tachyons.

That was directed at SaintLucifer.

The theory on tachs are just as sound a planks, time dilation, and the others! THEY ARE ALL FUCKING THEORIES! Once I can get you accept that and behave and discuse things on this order then we can get somewhere! But first... you need to get off the science pulpit and stop preaching your favorite theories as facts!

Time Dilation is an observed fact. Have you read nothing what I've written?

#1. You have to prove time actualy exists. I think time does not exist in any fashion as these theories you have mentioned say it does. I see time in the intellectual equivilent of math. Both are consepts. Each one taught, and no partical matter/energy enforces each others rules! Time is just like math, a CONCEPT we use to measure the change in states of matter/energy in a way we can understand things! Something to HELP put things into perspective.

Time is just a word meant to signify matter and energy moving forward in the 'arrow of time,' which could be understood as 'what will happen.'

If I take a glass and throw it on the floor, it will break. It will interact with gravity, pass through the air, connect with the floor, etc. The 'time' part is simply an index of which phase of falling it is.

If my room with the glass was travelling at relativistic speeds, time dilation would occur. I wouldn't notice any difference but if you would observe from far away, it would appear to drop much slower because the interactions slow down, including my own ability to percieve it.

The interactions would occur at a different rate. 'Time' is just a word to describe it.

#2. If time does exist there MUST be a control mechanism. It could be planck time, nuclear time, string, blah blah blah or blah! But the simple fact is, If time is real, then it can be traveled!

What were you doing 5 minutes ago? Did you not exist?

We only need a mechanism for it! Of course this also means that past, present, and future must all exist at the same time.

No, you misunderstand things slightly. If this were true, time would be considered a higher dimension.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesseract

If you like, we can go into extra-dimensional physics. But since we can't observe them, it would be nothing more than math and theories.

This is where the infinite matter/energy at every point in space comes into play!

Not at all. Xeno's Paradox does not exist in reality. It would be the current matter and energy, multiplied by how many Planck times the universe has experienced. Not a small number, but not infinite.

I know most people cant seem to grasp the depth of this because their miniscule intellect cannot bridge the gap out of this here and now attitude! You like everyone else lives with the assumption that ours is the ONLY reality here. You may be dead ass wrong, and yet your pathetic theories turn a blind eye!

I have presented you with very valid theories, along with demonstrated physical reality.

You will proceed to deconstruct them with something other than a sophomoric understanding of physics and ravings and rhetoric, or shut the fuck up.

Take for example if any one of the religions here are Earth are true. All it takes is for just about any one of them to be true. Guess what? We now have to get science to contend with multi dimensional energy/time, and physics. Not to mention the fact that part of the controls on these are FTL manipulations of existance! Now does that not just put a fucking kink into things? Here we are traveling along in our own little exsistence having a party and something wholey beyond reality comes and rears its ugly head because we are too short sighted to (and I hate this cliche) think outside our box! Call it aliens, call it spirits, call it what ever you want. We have more than enough ancient and current phenomena that appear around earth! I dont think science is up to the task. Why? because science has turned into a religion. And now that it has dogmatic foundations in certain theories, like einsteins, and a few others it has become corrupt. People like you have declared some of these "Unproven" theories as corner stones to our physical plane. And you dont like anything that comes along to debunk your claims. Guess what! If something comes along to debunk, you should be to the first to accept it! Its the tenet of science to review and find the truth of things. Lately science has only been conducted in biased fashion to only do one thing! Help prove or provide evidence to support that persons claim. It is rarely conducted to actually find the truth! The contrary research is thusly thrown in the trash!

he he... what do you think of that? I dont mind your theories in certain aspects. I just have this enormous put off about time and you theories erronious concept of it. Until they get time right... screw them. Why? because I cant have any respect for a bunch of whack jobs too stupid to understand what time "really" is! Who is the one short on brain power? It is not I! Especially when I am the one left asking for more! I see beyond their pathetic veils!

What you're doing is making a big deal out of a small misunderstanding. That's to say, getting worked up over not comprehending something as simple as 'time,' and its applications in physics.


Anything else?

 

[Astral]

Ok. What extra information does a tesseract bring to the topic? It is just a bunch of manifolds that lean on euclidian theory and of course leads to general relativity! Bringing a further extension into the thread does nothing. Your only piling more theory on top of one that is already in question!

Tell me this! If am alreay questioning the foundations of theories that lead to things like Time Dilation, and now your Tesseracts why do you bother to bring them up? I have already told you why the experiement regarding Time Dilation is BS. Its up to you to understand how it is BS based on what I told you. Regardless of what kind of watch you use... Nuclear down to plastic gears gravitational differences effect the outcome. They already knew this, they just did the experiment to sucker people like you into thinking this was some valid justification for Time Dilation! I could have told those idiots before they did the experiment that they will experience different speeds concerning clocks when they are exposed to lower gravitational potentials. However... this does not stipulate that 2 objects will slow their approach at each others bodies! This only applies to 2 seperate bodies and not one that is adjacent to each other. A clock is all adjacent. I will say that it is reasonable to believe that objects velocity will change when their inertial properties are changed by transversing an alternate gravitational potential. This however does not require their speeds TO change. This is with the stipulation that they are acted upon by an outside force. Just as the laws of motion/inertia apply here the object will resist change! Only that the impetus for the effect of change is different dependant upon the gravitational potential. So as you can tell the experiement only provided a proof to a forgone conclusion... however it does not prove the existance of an actual time mechanism. If you cannot understand that then I cant help you!

I will put it to you this way. If you travelled to an object 2 light years away at 2x the speed of light! Based on much of your theory you would not practically age at all and you would have also arrived at said object IN THE PAST!!! How is this stipulated? Because you could grab a telescope powerfull enough to watch people walk by on planet earth and you will have seen them 1 year in the past! Now suppose you had a special bomb and a button that could detonate it instantaniously regardless of distance you still would not be blowing up the Past. You will still blow up the current time and date you exist in! But it will take you 2 years to visually see your work because light will take that long to convey the image to you!

now... under some of the stipulations as place in "SpaceTime" a person should age less the closer they come to the threshold! Why? because they are in a low gravitational well! Why? because when objects approach light speed they begin to exibit their OWN lower than normal gravity wells! In this state all matter should thusly move SLOWER... this means lower respiration, waste, metabolism the WORKS! However... this does not mean that TIME is passing any different for you or the rest of the universe! The explanation of this so called time dilation is the same as putting someone on ICE! their metabolism slows, respiration, The works!!! But guess what!!! Time still has not changed! Now! exibiting this fact what would happen if you say... introduced a nuclear explosion in the middle of your FTL travel as well as your stasis!!! its an end all! Why? Because no matter how fast your traveling the nuclear explosion will happen in "regular" time and not at the same time frame you are traveling in! In this fasion the nuclear explosion will happen at the same speed in its affects to particles not adjacent to it regardless of electron speed. Their reactions to each other physically will go off without a hitch!

In short,many ways your theories rely on time as an actual control mechanism for making sure that object perform as they should. I am only saying there is no such proof and most of the theories actually do not fully support each other in this regard. Why is it that all you nuts run around supporting all these theories when at certain funamental levels they dissagree with each other? I guess its just more convenitent to act like the rest of the other religous cultures and "over look" or "give a pass" to things that are contradictory. Because of this I consider many things in science to be nothing more than dogmatic religion!

Before you try... dont bring up entropy! entropy can actually exist while time still does not! I tend to dissagree with entropy by the reasoning that energy never decreases or increases... it only transfers! If an object appears to exibit entropy this only means they failed to find out where or to what form energy transfered to.

Cute diagram of a cheap device to detect FTL objects. Like I said before... unless the contruct is capable processing at FTL it will not be possible to "grab" all the data in any form of intelligable data!

Your comparison of my infinite matter/energy at a single point to Xeno's paradox is absolutely stupid and shows you dont have any form of a reasonable scientific response! Much less appears to show that you are not capable of comprehending it either. Also just to add... the only way that my stipulation would not be infinite and just a really big number means there is an ultimate end to existance because when time stops so does it all! The reason for it requiring infinite/energy mass is because time is generally regarded as no beggining and no ending... its just forever!

I contend that it has always been the here and now since "The beggining of time"(to coin a phrase). The only difference between now and any time in the past is that the molecules are organized differently! Because of this... there is a such thing as a future and not just another chapter in a book already written. And also because of this time travel is not possible! And because of this the general explanation of time in many theories that stipulate time as a physical force come off as sheer low brow intelligence invading the scientific community!

Now to get all political, this is the tell a lie enough to get people to believe it as truth phenomena. No matter how much of a lie it is, it gets bashed over your head until people forget the truth from hearing the lie so much! You need no look any further than history to know this is established fact!

Your turn!

 

[Astral]

I also took the liberty of explaining the time Paradox a Tesseract presents. now... I just made it short... I have drawn the direction of time in each SINGLE dimension manifold. As you can tell that time flow contradicts itself on some of the single dimensional manifolds. I didnt even bother with trying to show direction of time across the 2 dimensional manifolds as you can already tell where that would lead. Remember... if time is an actual physical affecting entity/mechanism then its flow MUST be uniform across all manifolds!

Now this is just one representation but none the less, no matter which style type or structure you use, you will run into a contradiction in terms of flow of time on some of the manifolds! But like I said... lets get the funny stuff cleared out on the foundational theories first. I just had to do this to keep you from proceeding, since you keep trying to stack on more non essential junk to this conversation!

 

[Tyrant]

Ok. What extra information does a tesseract bring to the topic? It is just a bunch of manifolds that lean on euclidian theory and of course leads to general relativity! Bringing a further extension into the thread does nothing. Your only piling more theory on top of one that is already in question!

You stated that 'time' existing meant that matter, in all of it's paths and phases, must exist somewhere. I'm stating that time would be considered another dimension.

A tesseract is to a cube what a cube is to a square.

Tell me this! If am alreay questioning the foundations of theories that lead to things like Time Dilation, and now your Tesseracts why do you bother to bring them up?

I answered the foundations of the theories, and countered one of your more fanciful and fallacious claims about how time = time travel = infinite matter and energy.

I have already told you why the experiement regarding Time Dilation is BS.

Yes, and you're continued dissention to it without providing some proof against it only makes me take you less seriously.

Its up to you to understand how it is BS based on what I told you.

You've given me nothing of substance. Nothing.

Regardless of what kind of watch you use... Nuclear down to plastic gears gravitational differences effect the outcome.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_dilation

Time dilation is the phenomenon where the observed time rate of an observer's reference frame is different from that of a different reference frame. In Albert Einstein's theories of relativity the effect is manifested in two ways:

Time dilation of magnitude corresponding to this (Lorentz) factor has been experimentally confirmed.

They already knew this, they just did the experiment to sucker people like you into thinking this was some valid justification for Time Dilation!

I think it was done before I was born, silly!

I could have told those idiots before they did the experiment that they will experience different speeds concerning clocks when they are exposed to lower gravitational potentials. However... this does not stipulate that 2 objects will slow their approach at each others bodies! This only applies to 2 seperate bodies and not one that is adjacent to each other. A clock is all adjacent. I will say that it is reasonable to believe that objects velocity will change when their inertial properties are changed by transversing an alternate gravitational potential. This however does not require their speeds TO change. This is with the stipulation that they are acted upon by an outside force. Just as the laws of motion/inertia apply here the object will resist change! Only that the impetus for the effect of change is different dependant upon the gravitational potential.

Time Dilation has been experimentally confirmed. Don't attack the experiments simply because you don't agree with the results.

So as you can tell the experiement only provided a proof to a forgone conclusion... however it does not prove the existance of an actual time mechanism.

I think you're having trouble understanding the concept of time.

If you cannot understand that then I cant help you!

Uh-huh.

I will put it to you this way. If you travelled to an object 2 light years away at 2x the speed of light! Based on much of your theory you would not practically age at all and you would have also arrived at said object IN THE PAST!!! How is this stipulated? Because you could grab a telescope powerfull enough to watch people walk by on planet earth and you will have seen them
1 year in the past!

Nonsense. You're having difficulty visualizing the entire problem:

An object moving at high speeds experiences molecular reactions and all possible motions at slower speeds, right? This can only be observed by an outside entity, since even the perception of the observer of the craft would be distorted.

Travelling at the speed of light would dilate time extraordinarily, making the rest of the universe appear to move very quickly, while the observer onboard the craft goes about his business.

Travelling faster than the speed of light should only dilate it further. Why should it reverse it?

now... under some of the stipulations as place in "SpaceTime" a person should age less the closer they come to the threshold! Why? because they are in a low gravitational well! Why? because when objects approach light speed they begin to exibit their OWN lower than normal gravity wells! In this state all matter should thusly move SLOWER... this means lower respiration, waste, metabolism the WORKS!

Thanks for repeating my own ideas.

However... this does not mean that TIME is passing any different for you or the rest of the universe!

For all intents and purposes, it is.

Let me find the post where I stated this....

Ah.

http://www.trollkingdom.com/forum/showpost.php?p=759561&postcount=46

I think it's time to make a distinction here. It might save us some trouble:

I believe that two 'forms' of time exist. One is the reaction of matter and energy to the forces holding the universe together. For instance, how quickly an electron will orbit an atomic nucleus in relation to an outside observer, molecular reactions, all translating into how quickly one would age and how quickly 'time' (Observable, relevant sense) would pass.

The other is a sort of a non-observable 'absolute time,' which would be completely free of any influence.

The explanation of this so called time dilation is the same as putting someone on ICE! their metabolism slows, respiration, The works!!! But guess what!!! Time still has not changed!

It has for the observer.

Now! exibiting this fact what would happen if you say... introduced a nuclear explosion in the middle of your FTL travel as well as your stasis!!! its an end all! Why? Because no matter how fast your traveling the nuclear explosion will happen in "regular" time and not at the same time frame you are traveling in!

Wrong. Assuming the bomb was onboard the craft, it would experience the same effects of slowing down.

In this fasion the nuclear explosion will happen at the same speed in its affects to particles not adjacent to it regardless of electron speed. Their reactions to each other physically will go off without a hitch!

You still don't understand - it affects everything.

In short,many ways your theories rely on time as an actual control mechanism for making sure that object perform as they should.I am only saying there is no such proof and most of the theories actually do not fully support each other in this regard.

Then you haven't been reading.

Why is it that all you nuts run around supporting all these theories when at certain funamental levels they dissagree with each other?

In your eyes. Then again, you haven't been reading. Can we expect more philosophical tangents?

I guess its just more convenitent to act like the rest of the other religous cultures and "over look" or "give a pass" to things that are contradictory. Because of this I consider many things in science to be nothing more than dogmatic religion!

Right on cue.

Before you try... dont bring up entropy!

OK. I'll wait for you to bring it up...

entropy can actually exist while time still does not! I tend to dissagree with entropy by the reasoning that energy never decreases or increases... it only transfers!

LOL. Do you even know what 'entropy' means?

From where did you copy and paste that stuff on gravitation potential, anyway?

If an object appears to exibit entropy this only means they failed to find out where or to what form energy transfered to.

It transfers into a more disorded state. Are you going to argue with the laws of thermodynamics now?

Cute diagram of a cheap device to detect FTL objects. Like I said before... unless the contruct is capable processing at FTL it will not be possible to "grab" all the data in any form of intelligable data!

Then you have trouble understanding that as well.

That "cheap device" was the way ingenious humans were able to calculate the speed of light... in 1895, with only a margin of error of 5%.

Oh, fuck it. You need a picture book do understand it:

And before you go on a rant about how information couldn't be shared between the computer clocks FTL, I'll state that the distance between them need not be light seconds in order to gauge the speed.

Your comparison of my infinite matter/energy at a single point to Xeno's paradox is absolutely stupid and shows you dont have any form of a reasonable scientific response! Much less appears to show that you are not capable of comprehending it either. Also just to add... the only way that my stipulation would not be infinite and just a really big number means there is an ultimate end to existance because when time stops so does it all!

You really are the Jillian of physics, aren't you? :lol:

The reason for it requiring infinite/energy mass is because time is generally regarded as no beggining and no ending... its just forever!

I don't think you understand the ramification a boundless universe would bring.

There would be an infinite number of forces pressing against our own.

A timeline expanding backwards into infinity would mean that there would be an infinite number of opportunities in the past to disrupt our current universe.

I contend that it has always been the here and now since "The beggining of time"(to coin a phrase).

There would be no way for it to exist in such a state unless everything was obliterated and recreated. Even a leftover photon would accumulate to an infinite number, since it would be leftover from an infinite past and hence, and infinite number of photons.

The only difference between now and any time in the past is that the molecules are organized differently!

I agree, if you mean to say that it's the same matter, only in a different position in space.

Because of this... there is a such thing as a future and not just another chapter in a book already written. And also because of this time travel is not possible!

Why are you shouting? I already stated my belief that the idea of time travel was nonsese.

And because of this the general explanation of time in many theories that stipulate time as a physical force come off as sheer low brow intelligence invading the scientific community!

And once again, you totally misunderstand.

Now to get all political,

Since I'm not interesting, I won't bother.

Your turn!

 

[Tyrant]

I also took the liberty of explaining the time Paradox a Tesseract presents. now... I just made it short... I have drawn the direction of time in each SINGLE dimension manifold. As you can tell that time flow contradicts itself on some of the single dimensional manifolds. I didnt even bother with trying to show direction of time across the 2 dimensional manifolds as you can already tell where that would lead. Remember... if time is an actual physical affecting entity/mechanism then its flow MUST be uniform across all manifolds!

Talk about irrelavant.

since you keep trying to stack on more non essential junk to this conversation!

Then grow a brain and understand what I was trying to convey when I stated that time would be considered another dimension in our universe.

 

[Astral]

Ok. You simpley cant understand what I am saying. This is nothing new to me. I have told many people this before and not many can understand what I say. You just like all the others still offer replies like you didnt get a good dose of reading comprehension.

If you cant even understand what I am typing its obvious you will never get to my level. Go ahead and continue to play with all these stupid theories that contradict each other and continue to live your life by them. And while you and the rest of the idiots in science continue to have to create more and more retarded theories because your first ones prove to never fully explain things, you will have so many theories on your selves that you will never be able to keep up with them all.

I am going to say one thing! Since you blew off the tesseract and how time in all the manifold contradicted each other I am just going to say that you dont understand any of this enough to bother having this conversation with!

I will no longer continue to reply to this thread. I hope you do bone up on more of your theories. I is apparent that we will never see eye to eye. Not because you may know less or more than me, but because you simple cannot comprehend what I post.

Good day!

 

[Tyrant]

I'm not the one with the childish interpretation of the universe. For fuck's sake, you didn't even understand the basic laws of thermodynamics!

I would like to hear more from you when you order the paperbacks Hambil suggested. If you can afford them, of course.

 

[Tyrant]

 

[Colonel Kira's Left Tit]

This is a good thread.

 

[Tyrant]

And now for the post-killing blow desecration of the corpse:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cassini-Huygens

On October 10, 2003, the Cassini science team announced the results of a test of Einstein's theory of general relativity, using radio signals from the Cassini probe.

The researchers observed a frequency shift in the radio waves to and from the spacecraft, as those signals traveled close to the Sun. According to the theory of general relativity, a massive object like the Sun causes space-time to curve, and a beam of radio waves (or light) that passes by the Sun has to travel further because of the curvature. The extra distance that the radio waves travel from Cassini past the Sun to the Earth delays their arrival; the amount of the delay provides a sensitive test of the predictions of Einstein's theory. Although deviations from general relativity are expected in some cosmological models, none were found in this experiment. Past tests were in agreement with the theoretical predictions with an accuracy of one part in one thousand. The Cassini experiment improved this to about 20 parts in a million, with the data still supporting Einstein's theory.

 

[obsidian]

Messenger/Zodiac/Kefka's finest hour.

 

[obsidian]

Carl Sagan's Cosmos series on the Science Channel

Sometimes I think this series should be required viewing for everyone on this planet.

Episodes 8 & 13 are the real standouts. #8 is the one that gives the most succinct explanation of the limits of near-light-speed travel, and the consequences of surpassing it. I find it helps to think of it less as the speed of light, than as the speed of reality, because in a sense, that's exactly what it is.

 

[obsidian]

Maybe there are Aliens. Maybe they're reptiles, like velociraptors that didn't get wiped out by an asteroid, that had a chance to evolve larger brains and opposable thumbs, that developed civilization, religion, science, fought lots of wars (well shit: if they evolved from fucking velociraptors), managed not to annihilate themselves, and eventually, through centuries of accumulating hard-won wisdom, were able to 1. build ships that could travel between solar systems, albiet slowly, and 2. come up with some technological advance that could support long-term hibernation. Maybe, then, groups of volunteers set out, never to return to their home planet (do you think if our world population doubled and turned Earth into a cesspool, there would be any shortage of such volunteers?), and, after millenia of travel, they lucked across our radio signals, came here, and are now sitting in some camoflaged mothership, sending sorties down to study us?

Maybe. I doubt it severely, but maybe.

One thing I'm certain of: It ain't gonna be STAR TREK. Warp speed my ass.