Inside the mind of a troll

[Hambil]

This is something I've been thinking about on and off for a long time.

What makes a troll tick, if you will? I was never really a troll (I never went to other boards with the sole purpose of trolling) but I do seem to have a natural gift for pissing people off.

But, there is a different kind of trolling, one I see seems to be coming from motivations I don't understand. And this type of trolling is not the going after a board for hate speech, or some such - it's going after people directly with either true or made up personal attacks that in many cases actually upset the person being attacked.

Is it supposed to be in fun. Do those doing it not realize that this style of trolling is hurting people that don't deserve it, when there are plenty of places to troll that do deserve it, and styles of trolling that are far more productive.

To me, it just represents laziness. Either troll the people who really need it - banks, wallstreet, white power groups, whatever your hot button, or just hang up your troll hat. I just don't understand the motivation behind personal attacks.

If someone can explain it, I'd love to understand it better.

 

[jack]

Don't look at me.

 

[DarthSikle]

he means me

 

[Ilyanna]

No shit. Not that subtle a rodent, are you, dear?

There is a real problem with your inquiry, Hambil: you are asking for a straight-forward answer in a public forum on a troll board from someone you call a lazy troll. Do you really expect this to be a productive discussion?

 

[DarthSikle]

and for the record, LOP does deserve it.

I was kicked out against the policies and they refuse to give me a fair shake.

 

[DarthSikle]

I find it cute that he has been thinking of me on and off for a long time.

 

[Hambil]

I don't understand why people take things so personally, other than 'it's a troll board' - the age old TK arguement (yawn).

I see something, it makes me think, or reminds me of something I want to say, so I say it. Do you really think the minor little incident that wasn't even really much of an incident with you Darth, sent me off on some personal rant that you are completely responsible for?

As for the 'lazy' remark, it's only really negative if the person using it isn't asking for clarification. In otherwords: You are lazy! is not the same as Explain to me why this isn't lazy behavior, but here is my argument as to why I feel that way, and I'd like to here your counter point.

Perhaps, elevation of conversation, even briefly, has just gone away and died.

 

[DarthSikle]

Do you really think the minor little incident that wasn't even really much of an incident with you Darth, sent me off on some personal rant that you are completely responsible for?

yes

 

[Hambil]

^lol - that explains a lot. No wonder you hate me.

 

[jack]

I hated you when I first met you, but that's only because I was "supposed" to, and you were pretty deserving of some of it.

But then, I spent some time with you over the years here and there, and got a glimmer as to what was behind the fingers on the keyboard, and I decided that I liked you.

I'm glad I took the time to patch things up, because I think you're worth it.

 

[Hambil]

Thanks Jack. Please tell folks who for some reason have never believed it that I am a nice guy, and never actually have malicious intent.

The closest I come to malicious intent is largely the same as many of you - posting something (usually on here in the old days) for the specific purpose of getting a reaction. I liked to sprinkle humor on it, too - if political usually sarcastic or dark humor (taking things to the extreme). But, I never understood how it got so ugly and personal.

Well, I sort of do - I think it started with CU. You see, I went to Exisle, where he had said he had been trolling for two years and hadn't been discovered. I really did nothing different there than here - I engaged in heated political debate in OT.

CU, being a conservative at the time (and probably still) got into it with me on politics, and I guess decided the best way to get rid of me (assigning motives I'm unsure of here) was to accuse me of being a troll. That seems like an easy tactic since I used my same username, was a TK admin, and such - and at the time EI was very anti-TK.

However, in the spat that ensued, he said something that gave him away as being CU (I really didn't know until that moment). I pointed out that he had outed himself. He flipped, posted a long swearing rant that got him banned, and then from that point on I was some 'master troll' with some amazing ability to drive all of you nuts... I have no idea why. Perhaps you all got caught up in the CU wake of something - I'm sure he must have had a certain charisma to some.

By the time Messenger arrived (and by the way, I stand by - and I think so does history and the facts - my original judgements about CU and Messy, as being serious trouble) CU had already primed the troops. Suddenly I was in a 'war' that I didn't even have any interest in and hadn't even tried to cause.

So, I fought - because that's my nature I guess. I got bullied a lot as a kid and online, well, I don't have to take it

In the end, I guess you could say I won. I'm here today, as tech admin, and they are gone. But, only after considerable pain (with perspective - it's still just a message board) to a bunch of people.

I think we all lost. Can we just call it over now?

 

[Hambil]

I do understand something now that I didn't then - and that contributed in part also. For a long time I did not understand the minefield.

Do not get me wrong, I never had anything against it, even found it amusing. What I didn't understand was what it was really all about.

To most of us, a board is a place we go to hang out and blow off some steam or whatever. But for some of the minefielder's, I think the forum serves a very real need in their lives, more so than I understood.

The result of this - when I was playing with the board and mods and hacks - though I think a lot of good came from it, I was disrupting the posting in the minefield. And I didn't realize why that was a big deal. Now I do.

Though, perhaps not as bad as the misunderstanding that led to the CU/Messy/Jack war, it seems to have left a scar on my relation to the minefield. That's okay, but kind of unfortunate. Because now that I understand what it really is, I kind of could use it.

Anyway, I am here to hopefully, this time, do no harm intentional or otherwise. TK has grown too small for this. I think it's time for us to stop fighting with each other.

 

[jack]

God, that was fucking AWESOME, and explains a fuckload.

Someone occasionally posts with his account, but he hasn't used it in a while.

 

[jack]

I still like to fight with people, wtf you mean? What's TK if you cant squeeze someone's base occasionally?

 

[Hambil]

Fighting, trolling, is fine. But it got way to personal. People wishing me to have another heart-attack and die - people insulting my wives looks - it was crazy.

Oh, and I don't set policy. I can't enforce anything other than the minimal rules the board already has. I'm saying this as Hambil (Mark), not as an admin.

 

[Ilyanna]

Hambil, you've directly gone from the EI thread where you asked Darth where "his decency is" to posting this thread. Of course this was about Darth, although I can see now how he was more of a trigger to what you wrote than the sole reason.

I'm a bit sensitive when it comes to what I perceive as passive-aggressive potshots, and to me, your OP was exactly that. I, personally, would have reacted completely different if you had addressed this in another way, for example directly in the EI thread. Not saying you should have done so, just that my reaction would have been different.

Reg. "lazy" - I didn't mean to imply that you offended with that remark - just that when you know that someone is lazy, it's pretty futile to expect a satisfying answer. Like expecting a lazy student to voluntarily write an essay of 30 pages.

Reg the original point: I'm not really trolling, so I can't give any real insight on that. As for personal attacks: I usually refrain unless somebody pisses me off enough to attack, both in RL and online, and then, frankly, I want my attacks to hurt. In cases like the one that I still believe triggered this: speaking solely for myself - if a personal jab is so outrageous or unfounded Hambil, you've directly gone from the EI thread where you asked Darth where "his decency is" to posting this thread. Of course this was about Darth, although I can see now how he was more of a trigger to what you wrote than the sole reason.

I'm terribly sensitive when it comes to what I perceive as passive-aggressive potshots, and to me, your OP was exactly that. I, personally, would have reacted completely different if you just had addressed this in another way, for example directly in the EI thread. Not saying you should have done so, just that my reaction would have been different.

Reg. "lazy" - I didn't mean to imply that you offended with that remark - just that when you know that someone is lazy, it's pretty futile to expect a satisfying answer. Like expecting a lazy student to voluntarily write an essay of 30 pages. :whistle:

Reg the original point: I'm usually not trolling, so I can't give any real insight to that part of the question. As for personal attacks: I usually refrain unless somebody pisses me off enough to attack, both in RL and online, and then, frankly, I want my attacks to hurt. As for cases like the one that triggered this: speaking solely for myself - if a personal jab of mine is so obviously outrageous or unfounded like that one (seriously, how would I know anything about LOP?), I most certainly pity anyone feeling hurt by it. And if, by any chance, I unknowingly stumble upon some trauma, I fully expect a grown-up person to have the balls to contact me and tell me to stfu.
As for Darth: anybody taking anything he posts seriously definitely get what they deserve imo.

posting something (usually on here in the old days) for the specific purpose of getting a reaction

There - that's an answer to your original question, at least a part of it.

Here: another part

and online, well, I don't have to take it

See, online is different from RL. If we applied the same kind of social codices we are used from RL to online life, we would not only be completely unrealistic, we'd also miss out on opportunities to explore our sociological paradigms. I've witnessed ppl who interacted in a very direct, open and kind of honest way online switch to the same kind of politically correct, overly polite and dishonest RL social conduct as soon as they met or talked offline or via direct E-mail/pm. Personal attacks directed at the target him/herself are quite a no-go IRL, for a variety of reasons, and that forces us to hold back. Maybe that's one reason why some people use the unique environment of mb's and online societies to break with the taboo - and some people exploit it.

 

[Donovan]

Trolling is kind of a fine art some people confuse with general boorishness or asshat behavior. It is a deft practice designed to let the wind out of the sails of those who desperately need it, and at the same time giving everyone a little chuckle. For example: changing certain forum options, no matter what the stated intent, is a fine troll because there are those who take such things a little too seriously and need to be reminded that not all is as lifeshattering as the color of karma stars.
On the other hand, the "boogeyman troll" is equally fine when handled correctly, such as Darth occasionally jumping out of the ExIsle bushes and yelling "Booga booga" at them so they'll continue to be frightened of him. Done well, this is very effective and requires very little effort (and let's face it, if we weren't ALL lazy bastards our hobbies would be hiking and hanggliding, not the fucking internet) however, done incorrectly it becomes a Comicon Jackdancer wandering back in after a long absence to find a disinterested audience. It's all about timing.
At any rate, the perfect Troll is a lot like Shakespeare's Fool; wise enough to tell a king from a codpiece, ingenious enough to get away with deliberately confusing the two, and likable enough that he or she can say with impunity that neither the king nor the codpiece is a more useful tool.

 

[Hambil]

There had also been a PM from Darth, between that comment in the thread and this post. A pm that specifically got me thinking along these lines, which I've thought of at times before. I am not sure why this would be considered a passive-aggressive attack - or...

I guess maybe I kind of get it, but it's just more of this crazy thinking on my part. You go into something (the generic you) thinking someone is a certain kind of person, and that is how you start reading everything they post.

In reality, you can do that to anyone, twist anything anyone posts no matter how hard they try, if your intent is already to do so - consciously or not.

I just wish people would stop assigning sinister motives to things I say that are not, and never have, existed.

 

[VKD]

it's like at school when a fight breaks out between two kids, instead of breaking it up you want to watch it.

But if it happens between adults you're obliged to break it up - except on the internet.

 

[jack]

I just like to whip out my enormous dick and smack people in the face with it.