What's up.

[Donovan]

hey Donovan, good to see ya back around.

you realise, of course that strong anger comes from strong pain?

....no moralising or castigations toward either of ya from me....IMHO you are both fighting the good fight.


So feel free to vent here as well...if ya can't vent your spleen at TK, where can ya?

I work in the same field and from listening to my own parents/relatives take sides when they were divorcing, your words "sharp words cut unexpected targets" certainly resonated with me.
Maybe that's why I find working with "behavioural" kids from "broken homes"so rewarding....been there.

See you around the board, OK?

Thank you curious. I really didn't mean to explode so harshly at Laker Girl to begin with, but you're absolutely right: stong anger comes from deep wounds. They never heal, and that's why I so strongly react when I perceive something happening to someone else in a similar fashion.

BTW, I didn't see this post when I stated above that no one was posting on behalf of the kids in this thread. I hereby include you in the elite but growing group of souls more interested in the welfare of the kids than in the petty arguments of adults.


And yes, you'll see me around this board from time to time. As I once said, there are a few here who have my respect and entertain me when I talk to them. Thanks for the nod...see you around.

 

[DarthSikle]

Did your deadbeat brother die yet?

 

[Friday]

Donovan....

You do make sense. However, please remember that L_G is coming from a good place. Any frustrations that she might voice here originate from the fact that she might, indeed, be a little resentful of her obligations. That is understandable.

I was in a similar situation in the past, and I suffered similar frustrations. Yet, I never let my negative feelings bleed thru. I was always very careful about that, as I'm sure L_G is, also.

Yes, I still bad mouth my sister, for she still is dropping the ball when it comes to her son. He's 24 now, and was in a life threatening accident last year. Of the two of us, who do you think dropped everything and flew to his bedside, and who do you think stayed home with her boyfriend? When I saw the look of relief and gratitude on his face when I walked into the ICU, I thanked God I decided to step up to my sister's plate.

So, not everything is black and white. There are shades of grey. That seems to be a concept you have a hard time grasping.

 

[Big Dick McGee]

There are hundreds of deserving couples or people out there begging for a chance to raise decent kids, who would not be quite so put upon to have to care for family.

Raising kids should not be a trial or something you have to vent about, and if you harbor that much resentment toward your own blood, I feel sorry for you because your soul must be empty. But I feel more sorry for them.

Do you actually bother to read any of the posts here, or are you so wrapped up in your own do-gooder bleeding heart liberalism that the facts escape you?

The kids in question are Laker_Girl's neice and nephew. Both of their parents are alive and competent to take care of the kids. Thus, and I'll put this in big type so even a touchy-feely twerp like you can see it: LG and her parents do not have legal custody of the kids, and have no legal right to determine where they live.

For the life of me, I can't fathom bleeding heart liberals like you. On the one hand, you hold abortion rights sancrosanct, under the guise of "personal choice"; on the other hand you want a woman who didn't choose to have kids be forced to raise them, and not complain about it to boot. The level of contradiction is staggering, but sadly, not uncommon amongst college-age liberals like yourself.

 

[Donovan]

Do you actually bother to read any of the posts here, or are you so wrapped up in your own do-gooder bleeding heart liberalism that the facts escape you?

The kids in question are Laker_Girl's neice and nephew. Both of their parents are alive and competent to take care of the kids. Thus, and I'll put this in big type so even a touchy-feely twerp like you can see it: LG and her parents do not have legal custody of the kids, and have no legal right to determine where they live.

For the life of me, I can't fathom bleeding heart liberals like you. On the one hand, you hold abortion rights sancrosanct, under the guise of "personal choice"; on the other hand you want a woman who didn't choose to have kids be forced to raise them, and not complain about it to boot. The level of contradiction is staggering, but sadly, not uncommon amongst college-age liberals like yourself.

You make an awful lot of assumptions here Dick. Sounds like I'm not the only one with a lot of anger management issues.

You don't mind if I shorten your name to Dick, do you? I'm certain others call you that, so you should be used to it.

I have already addressed the whys and wherefores of my strong reaction to Laker Girl's original post. I don't remember mentioning politics, abortion, or personal politics. Unlike you, I can recognize the fact that you are a twat without lumping all your friends in with you. Except Gagh, and I am pretty sure every one knows he's a twat.

So, without cluttering up my post with inane comments about nonrelated matters, I will review using short, easy to read words:

1. Laker Girl appears to be helping take care of children who need someone to do so. These children are her own flesh and blood. This is a good thing.

2. Laker Girl resents the hell out of this, and is so angry that she has been "forced" to care for her blood, she has complained publicly and privately in harsh terms about her brother, his ex-wife, his new girlfriend, and an entire town of 6,000 people.

3. She admits to taking time to do extensive "research" into her brother's life, which would indicate a healthy amount of nosiness on her part but whatever.

4. And yet, despite clear evidence to the contrary, Laker Girl and her friend the Dick insist she is a saint who never lets her resentment show around the kids. I find this hard to believe, since kids are very perceptive and Laker Girl is clearly very angry with the family.

5. Despite the Dick's flailing assertions, people who have taken in abandoned children have many legal rights, if they can establish that the children have been constructively abandoned. Laker Girl can log a journal of the days, times and hours she spends caring for the children. She can save all receipts, medical records, and school records to indicate guardianship. Then she can get a lawyer and present to the court that the parents have constructively abandoned the children, and petition for legal custody. Then she could abandon them to foster care or whatever, since she doesn't seem to want them. I'm sure they know it, too.

6. If Laker Girl spent her research skills looking up useful information instead of criminal records of strangers, she would know this.

7. If her friend wasn't a Dick, he'd tell her.

8. Throughout this entire exchange, I don't think I have ever faulted Laker Girl for caring for her niece and nephew, and I acknowledge it is an admirable thing. But to allow herself to be overcome with resentment toward her brother, his wife, and various assorted strangers is not good or healthy, and the kids will feel that. Trust me. They've already been abandoned by their parents, and their aunt doesn't want them either. These kids will have lots to work through by the time they are adults.

9. The above view is compassionate, not "bleeding heart". It makes me a human being, and that's what a Dick chooses to use as an insult, it really says more about him than me. I've been called worse.

10. I don't remember adding abortion, politics or college to the discussion, but I'd recognize opinions on those subjects if they came from a Dick like yourself. Feel free to start another thread, but this one is complicated enough.

 

[Friday]

Real quick...on a lunch break.

Just to be clear, Donaovan...I disagree vehemently with you about L_G. I think she's doing an admirable job, and the children will be better for having her in their lives.

That being said...

The way you voiced your opinions (and yes, they are opinions, not fact) made me laugh like hell! I really enjoy your style

 

[Laker_Girl]

Why are you so dense Donovan? You know nothing about me but what I've voiced here. Are you the kind of person that resents nothing and is a door mat or do you hold it all inside so some day you will explode like a bomb and kill everyone at a Denny's restaurant.

My niece and nephew know nothing but pure love from me, they don't sense that I resent having to care for them while their father is asleep or on the phone with his girlfriend, or while he's on his fifth vacation in a year seeing his girlfriend or while their mother is at a football game or whatever the hell else she wants to do, they're just glad I'm there. Hell, if my mother isn't home by the time I'm ready to leave and they're going to be left alone with their dad they beg me to stay. I don't just drudge through my day and snap at the children while attending to their every need and want. I hold them on my lap while I work, I kiss and hug them (much as my nephew hates it), when I drop them off at school I tell them to, "Learn a lot and remember that Auntie Laura loves you." I go to all their events, (which is more than I can say for my brother. While they were getting Honor Roll and Principal's Awards my worthless brother was with his worthless girlfriend in Alabama) I sit and do homework with them and if it means I have to work late and eats into my personal time I do it anyway because I love them and I know it's important to them. I create dinner menus which they love, I make sure they have Super Glue and batteries and just about anything else that pops into their heads. I go over their school lunch menu and help them decide if they want to buy or take so they never have to eat anything they don't want and a million other things. As I've previously stated I'd donate my beating heart for my niece or nephews, any one of them but raising them is hard and since I didn't choose to have them I'm a tad put out about having to raise them.

Not to mention that caring for my niece and nephew sometimes takes away from me visiting my other nephews and those two are the shizznit too I'll have you know.

As for your unwavering fear that my attitude toward their mother, father, her family and his girlfriend are going to scar my niece and nephew well that's just a big fat smelly load of crap. They know what their parents are and I'd never think of insulting their extreme intelligence by acting as if they don't.

Further, since you refuse to catch up...My brother was planning on ditching his kids and moving to Alabama right up until their mother disappeared and didn't show up until three months later and she was in a mental institution. On January 24, 2006 my brother plans on giving my parents guardianship of the children and high tailing it to Alabama. Their mom has managed to get a house in town but told my mom that she's, "Not ready to have the kids full time yet." While I respect that she recognizes her limits now and won't burden herself to the point of disappearing again perhaps that's something she should of thought about BEFORE birthing two children. The selfishness of these two is astounding and THANKS TO MY PARENTS AND ME THE CHILDREN AREN'T SUFFERING FOR IT.

Get it now, Blockhead?

 

[Shatna]

Those kids will never, ever forget what Auntie Laura did for them. End of story.

 

[Big Dick McGee]

I don't think he even reads your posts, he has a preconceived notion of you as a person, and you won't change his opinion. Things like "facts" won't change his mind.

 

[Shatna]

I will too!!!



What's a "fact"?

 

[Donovan]

This is the only part where you're dead wrong:

Posted by Laker Girl: "As for your unwavering fear that my attitude toward their mother, father, her family and his girlfriend are going to scar my niece and nephew well that's just a big fat smelly load of crap. They know what their parents are and I'd never think of insulting their extreme intelligence by acting as if they don't."


As I have said repeatedly, Laker Girl, I'm not rying to belittle any of the things you do to ensure the safety of your niece and nephew, and if true your position as surrogate mom is as admirable a thing as one can do in life. You have my respect for that.

But emotional trauma is one of the hardest things for a child to overcome, especially the abandonment issues that come with being basically ditched by both parents. It has nothing to do with intelligence, surface responses, or how good the life is that they go to. It's about that nagging, endless inner voice that says, "I wasn't good enough for my own parents." By openly disdaining, badmouthing and otherwise denigrating Mom, Dad, and assorted other people, you are CONTRIBUTING unwittingly to their future pain.

I don't expect you to agree with me, or suddenly somehow see the light and thank me for calling you out, Laker Girl. As you said, I don't know you and I have no true cause to put my opinions out there. Our paths will never likely cross. And after this post, my participation in this discussion is ended.

HOWEVER...

Here is what I guarantee will happen, and really is my goal. The next time you and your parents sit down at dinner and your brother is the trash subject du jour, you'll think of this exchange. The next time you feel the need to badmouth him, the ex, or anyone involved in their little sordid tale, you'll remember what I said and how it made you feel. The next time you feel you have to publicly correct, castigate or otherwise belittle either of them while the kids are present, you'll flash back to these posts.

And you will pause for a second to consider what you're saying.

One time out of three, you'll stop. And that will be enough, over time, to gradually change your attitude, your outlook on your situation, so subtly that it may take a few years to notice the difference.

On the day you realize that change, we'll probably have long since abandoned Troll Kingdom, so in advance I'll say: You're welcome.

You've been given an incredible opportunity, Laker Girl: a chance to create successful, well-adjusted, and healthy human beings (and no stretch marks or birthing pains). You didn't ask for it, but it's your hand. Play it well, and they'll make you proud forever. Fuck it up, and you'll have years ahead to regret. If nothing else, trust me on this.

 

[Donovan]

Why are you so dense Donovan? You know nothing about me but what I've voiced here. Are you the kind of person that resents nothing and is a door mat or do you hold it all inside so some day you will explode like a bomb and kill everyone at a Denny's restaurant.

PS. It'll be a Burger King. I fucking hate that plastic King guy, always smiling, always lurking at my window, always whispering things to me while I sleep...

 

[NeonMercuryASH]

Hi, LG! You got a new shirt! Security Pack 2!

 

[BitchSlapSmitty]

This is the only part where you're dead wrong:

Posted by Laker Girl: "As for your unwavering fear that my attitude toward their mother, father, her family and his girlfriend are going to scar my niece and nephew well that's just a big fat smelly load of crap. They know what their parents are and I'd never think of insulting their extreme intelligence by acting as if they don't."


As I have said repeatedly, Laker Girl, I'm not rying to belittle any of the things you do to ensure the safety of your niece and nephew, and if true your position as surrogate mom is as admirable a thing as one can do in life. You have my respect for that.

But emotional trauma is one of the hardest things for a child to overcome, especially the abandonment issues that come with being basically ditched by both parents. It has nothing to do with intelligence, surface responses, or how good the life is that they go to. It's about that nagging, endless inner voice that says, "I wasn't good enough for my own parents." By openly disdaining, badmouthing and otherwise denigrating Mom, Dad, and assorted other people, you are CONTRIBUTING unwittingly to their future pain.

I don't expect you to agree with me, or suddenly somehow see the light and thank me for calling you out, Laker Girl. As you said, I don't know you and I have no true cause to put my opinions out there. Our paths will never likely cross. And after this post, my participation in this discussion is ended.

HOWEVER...

Here is what I guarantee will happen, and really is my goal. The next time you and your parents sit down at dinner and your brother is the trash subject du jour, you'll think of this exchange. The next time you feel the need to badmouth him, the ex, or anyone involved in their little sordid tale, you'll remember what I said and how it made you feel. The next time you feel you have to publicly correct, castigate or otherwise belittle either of them while the kids are present, you'll flash back to these posts.

And you will pause for a second to consider what you're saying.

One time out of three, you'll stop. And that will be enough, over time, to gradually change your attitude, your outlook on your situation, so subtly that it may take a few years to notice the difference.

On the day you realize that change, we'll probably have long since abandoned Troll Kingdom, so in advance I'll say: You're welcome.

You've been given an incredible opportunity, Laker Girl: a chance to create successful, well-adjusted, and healthy human beings (and no stretch marks or birthing pains). You didn't ask for it, but it's your hand. Play it well, and they'll make you proud forever. Fuck it up, and you'll have years ahead to regret. If nothing else, trust me on this.

Damn, well said man. Fuck the rest of the people who are just on here to shout in a shit box, this is good advice.

 

[Friday]

With every fiber in my being rebelling, I must admit...

The man makes sense.

Abandonment issues....prevalent in children who have been dumped on family members. And adoptees.

This is a very, very interesting, relevant insight.

 

[Friday]

Honest question...

Donovan, you've mentioned that you're taking Celexa. Do you suffer from depression? (Not searching for troll fodder. I'm genuinely interested).

 

[Donovan]

Honest question...

Donovan, you've mentioned that you're taking Celexa. Do you suffer from depression? (Not searching for troll fodder. I'm genuinely interested).

Actually, it's supposedly for anxiety or something. I was looking for a way to take the edge off my ADD symptoms, which I've always coped with without meds but which recently began to interfere with my job and to some extent my life. The doc said it was probably stress/anxiety aggravating the existing condition, so I should go with the celexa. I've never been a pill-taker per se, but if enough people are telling you the same thing about yourself you gotta start listening sometime. Strangely enough, a few people seem to think I'm an obnoxious prick with anger management issues. I know, shocking ain't it?

Jury's still out on whether it works or not. Seems like I don't get quite so angry these days, but my appetite is gone and my motivation is shot to hell...one of those things is good, the other not so much.

 

[Laker_Girl]

This is the only part where you're dead wrong:

Posted by Laker Girl: "As for your unwavering fear that my attitude toward their mother, father, her family and his girlfriend are going to scar my niece and nephew well that's just a big fat smelly load of crap. They know what their parents are and I'd never think of insulting their extreme intelligence by acting as if they don't."


As I have said repeatedly, Laker Girl, I'm not rying to belittle any of the things you do to ensure the safety of your niece and nephew, and if true your position as surrogate mom is as admirable a thing as one can do in life. You have my respect for that.

But emotional trauma is one of the hardest things for a child to overcome, especially the abandonment issues that come with being basically ditched by both parents. It has nothing to do with intelligence, surface responses, or how good the life is that they go to. It's about that nagging, endless inner voice that says, "I wasn't good enough for my own parents." By openly disdaining, badmouthing and otherwise denigrating Mom, Dad, and assorted other people, you are CONTRIBUTING unwittingly to their future pain.

I don't expect you to agree with me, or suddenly somehow see the light and thank me for calling you out, Laker Girl. As you said, I don't know you and I have no true cause to put my opinions out there. Our paths will never likely cross. And after this post, my participation in this discussion is ended.

HOWEVER...

Here is what I guarantee will happen, and really is my goal. The next time you and your parents sit down at dinner and your brother is the trash subject du jour, you'll think of this exchange. The next time you feel the need to badmouth him, the ex, or anyone involved in their little sordid tale, you'll remember what I said and how it made you feel. The next time you feel you have to publicly correct, castigate or otherwise belittle either of them while the kids are present, you'll flash back to these posts.

And you will pause for a second to consider what you're saying.

One time out of three, you'll stop. And that will be enough, over time, to gradually change your attitude, your outlook on your situation, so subtly that it may take a few years to notice the difference.

On the day you realize that change, we'll probably have long since abandoned Troll Kingdom, so in advance I'll say: You're welcome.

You've been given an incredible opportunity, Laker Girl: a chance to create successful, well-adjusted, and healthy human beings (and no stretch marks or birthing pains). You didn't ask for it, but it's your hand. Play it well, and they'll make you proud forever. Fuck it up, and you'll have years ahead to regret. If nothing else, trust me on this.

Read what I post or stop addressing me. I do not trash/bad mouth my brother, my ex sister-in-law, her family or my brother's girlfriend in front of my niece and nephew. I've said that at least twice now so PAY ATTENTION, I'm tired of repeating myself.

That's one, two, I just realized I've left something out in all of my posts. A little over a month ago my parents put the children on their health insurance because my brother couldn't be bothered and their mother no longer has a job. The first thing my mother did was contact a child psychologist recommended by a psychologist friend of hers in her golf club. Two and a half weeks ago the children were evaluated and they see their psychologist once every other week, my mom or dad takes them. We're working very hard to ensure that any issues they have, past, present and future are properly addressed. Beyond what we're currently doing, ensuring their comfort and security and giving them an outlet to work out their feeling about their mom, dad, family and current situation I know of nothing else we could be doing. I've also taken it upon myself to give them a spiritual outlet and take them to church with me, they enjoy it very much.

I've thought of everything, I occasionally see my nephew act out, whether it's crying for what seems like no reason at all or hitting I sit him down and we patiently untangle his feelings. I assure him it's okay, try and calm him down and give him other options to "get it out"...I'm no saint but I'm doing my best and if you've got some other idea of what my family and myself should be doing and like Tom Cruise you know more than the child psychologist working with them I'd sure like to hear it otherwise, keep your ignorant, judgmental opinions to yourself.

Oh and, have a nice day.

 

[BitchSlapSmitty]

Read what I post or stop addressing me. I do not trash/bad mouth my brother, my ex sister-in-law, her family or my brother's girlfriend in front of my niece and nephew. I've said that at least twice now so PAY ATTENTION, I'm tired of repeating myself.

That's one, two, I just realized I've left something out in all of my posts. A little over a month ago my parents put the children on their health insurance because my brother couldn't be bothered and their mother no longer has a job. The first thing my mother did was contact a child psychologist recommended by a psychologist friend of hers in her golf club. Two and a half weeks ago the children were evaluated and they see their psychologist once every other week, my mom or dad takes them. We're working very hard to ensure that any issues they have, past, present and future are properly addressed. Beyond what we're currently doing, ensuring their comfort and security and giving them an outlet to work out their feeling about their mom, dad, family and current situation I know of nothing else we could be doing. I've also taken it upon myself to give them a spiritual outlet and take them to church with me, they enjoy it very much.

I've thought of everything, I occasionally see my nephew act out, whether it's crying for what seems like no reason at all or hitting I sit him down and we patiently untangle his feelings. I assure him it's okay, try and calm him down and give him other options to "get it out"...I'm no saint but I'm doing my best and if you've got some other idea of what my family and myself should be doing and like Tom Cruise you know more than the child psychologist working with them I'd sure like to hear it otherwise, keep your ignorant, judgmental opinions to yourself.

Oh and, have a nice day.

Why didn't you just say that in the begginning instead of all the bitching?

 

[Donovan]

Like I said, Laker Girl: my point is made, but you won't know it until the next time you start to trash your family members. You'll think of this white-hot rage you feel right now, which is really the secret shame of knowing I hit way too close for comfort. Otherwise you wouldn't be so adamantly defending your actions to a total stranger.

You've made mistakes; you'll continue to make them. But sometimes, just the memory of what has been said here today will be enough to stop you, and that makes all this effort worthwhile.

Good luck with your brother's children, and I mean that truly and deeply. They will be your best life's work...