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Lost season 6 FINAL CHAPTER

Dual said:
That wasn't in an alternate reality, that was his past. It was put together with Sun's story in the present to make it a bit confusing.
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Hmmm... I thought there were cuts of Sun in the hospital room delivering a baby and the end of that episode was Jin responding to someone that the baby wasn't his, he wasn't married, and the implication was Sun was married to someone else.

I know in the most recent alternate life, Sun and Jin aren't married but they are having an affair and she is pregnant. Sun's father had Jin deliver the gold watch to someone who was supposed to kill Jin - the watch was payment for that. Sayyid saved his life. But, Sun was shot.

I need to buy the collection and watch it all from the beginning. There is so much I've forgotten.
 
It was Locke, not one of the 6, who went to see Walt. We already knew he wasn't dead, though. That was a pretty major point in season 2, and in 4 we saw Michael's flashback to when he left the island with Walt. The Others kept saying that Walt was special, but that thread's been forgotten. If they even had anything like the current plot in mind going back to the early seasons (and that's doubtful) Walt probably would've been a prime candidate or something. His special abilities as hinted at earlier on were probably going to be telepathy, I think, since he communicated with Shannon like you said.

As for Vincent the dog, he was living with Rose and Bernard in 1977. Whether they got thrown back to 2007 with Jughead's explosion is something that will probably not be addressed, but it doesn't seem unlikely.
 
eloisel said:
Hmmm... I thought there were cuts of Sun in the hospital room delivering a baby and the end of that episode was Jin responding to someone that the baby wasn't his, he wasn't married, and the implication was Sun was married to someone else.

I know in the most recent alternate life, Sun and Jin aren't married but they are having an affair and she is pregnant. Sun's father had Jin deliver the gold watch to someone who was supposed to kill Jin - the watch was payment for that. Sayyid saved his life. But, Sun was shot.

I need to buy the collection and watch it all from the beginning. There is so much I've forgotten.
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Right, there were two separate babies being delivered. One was Ji Yeon, Sun and Jin's, in the present after the 6 left the island and Sun thought Jin was dead. The other was Jin delivering the panda on behalf of Mr. Paik to the wife of a minister or something, years earlier, before he had married Sun.
 
Archibald is correct about the C4. If four bricks of C4 were to be detonated in an air-tight space, under water, the flames themselves would envelop a good percentage of the ship. Also, anything in the flames would be liquefied and shot out of any opening in the hull. Given the short amount of time Sayid had to run away, he might have only gotten about 50' before he went kaboom.

OK, this week's ep. What language were they speaking at the beginning? I think MiB's predecessor was the one who trounced the village and covered the well, not the "mother".

One of the problems I have with these "ancient power" shows is this. If the light needs protecting from humans, has it only been around since humans were around? Also, if it was around before humans, did it require protection as soon as humans showed up? Therefore, since the first free-thinking logical human appeared, has there been a protector? Or, is it just since the time of naval travel that the island needs protection?

It falls under the creationist category. It seems to neglect the some odd billion years before humanity's current 10,000 year reign. IMO, the show just went out of Sci-Fi and entered Fantasy.
 
Cassie said:
Well, it answered who Adam and Eve were, who Jacob and the MIB were, and how MIB became smokey and why MIB and Jacob are enemies. ALSO, why they can't kill each other. Of course we were left with wondering who Jacob and MIB's murdering mom was and how she came to be in charge of the island. I guess we're supposed to figure out that she came to be there just like they did, by accident.

I think mom liked MIB best because she wanted to leave the island too. Probably for a really long time.
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Something just occured to me: I'd been thinking about the "light" as a Tree of Life/Tree of Knowledge metaphor and the smoke monster as, perhaps, the Snake...the Old Testament Adam & Eve were thrown out of Eden, but what about Adam's first wife, Lilith? Could she be the archetype for the "adoptive" mother of Jacob & MiB (who, in spite of some obvious parallels, don't quite seem to be Cain & Abel)

As for why they can't kill each other...because mommy said so? I'd really like to get a clue as to how these "rules" actually work, one of these days.
 
They were speaking Latin, Conch. I don't see any reason to assume MiB had a predecessor, although it's possible.
 
Dual said:
They were speaking Latin, Conch. I don't see any reason to assume MiB had a predecessor, although it's possible.
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I had assumed it was latin, but didn't want to speak out of turn.

Also, MiB had to have a predecessor. That's how these jungian/duality things work.

I mean, who appeared as his dead mother and led him to the other settlement on the island? That's MiB's MO.
 
Conchaga said:
I had assumed it was latin, but didn't want to speak out of turn.

Also, MiB had to have a predecessor. That's how these jungian/duality things work.

I mean, who appeared as his dead mother and led him to the other settlement on the island? That's MiB's MO.
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It could've just been a normal ghost. Wasn't there a spotlight on her? I don't think we've ever seen the smoke monster lit like that.

When Jacob forced the MiB into the light cave, it seemed like the light became darkness, and the darkness became Smokey. The fake mother had earlier said that the cave contained life, death, and rebirth, so I took that to mean that MiB's insertion did something to break the balance. We didn't see the cave after he got shot out, did we? That would've been helpful. I think that maybe Smokey actually is the light, just animated by MiB's understandably pissed off soul. Jacob's task then would've become keeping his non-corporeal brother on the island, and thereby protecting the light, or something. Incoherent rambling ftw.

Some people on The Fuselage seem to think that the fake mother was both the predecessor of Jacob and the MiB, since there were some hints about smokish-evil - burning the village, killing the real mother, even perhaps her initial affinity for the MiB. It's clear that nobody on the island is wholly good or wholly evil, though, so I don't know that a strict duality can really apply.
 
Even after having another day to think about this episode, I still think it was DULL. None of the stuff they revealed really mattered that much. It doesn't change anything to know who Adam and Eve were. It made that mystery completely pointless. Finding out what makes the island special turned it from a little bit sci fi, to a whole lot fantasy. I like fantasy, but I don't like it when I can't tell the difference because the writers switch it up. Electromagnetism is now sacred light, or some shit.

Lost is turning out to be a lot like BSG in that sense. Lots of mystic stuff that was interesting, but has now snowballed so that the writers are left to make some lame last minute explanations to tie it all together. I'm sure the ending won't be completely satisfying, but we'll still appreciate the series as a whole.
 
Dual said:
It could've just been a normal ghost. Wasn't there a spotlight on her? I don't think we've ever seen the smoke monster lit like that.
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I don't think there's been a follow-spot, but I have a theory about that.

When Jacob forced the MiB into the light cave, it seemed like the light became darkness, and the darkness became Smokey.
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I watched it again, and you're right. The light in the cave went out. Again, I've got a theory about that.

The fake mother had earlier said that the cave contained life, death, and rebirth, so I took that to mean that MiB's insertion did something to break the balance. We didn't see the cave after he got shot out, did we? That would've been helpful. I think that maybe Smokey actually is the light, just animated by MiB's understandably pissed off soul.
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OK, here's the theory. As Jacob throws his brother into the cave, you see him strike his head very hard. I think Jacob's brother was dead when he floated into the cave. Just what the light/smokey needed. A murdered/sacrificed body delivered to it, like it did with Locke.

Jacob's task then would've become keeping his non-corporeal brother on the island, and thereby protecting the light, or something. Incoherent rambling ftw.
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It's a shame you couldn't stick around longer. Incoherent rambling is fun and in groups it can lead to something coherent.

Some people on The Fuselage seem to think that the fake mother was both the predecessor of Jacob and the MiB, since there were some hints about smokish-evil - burning the village, killing the real mother, even perhaps her initial affinity for the MiB. It's clear that nobody on the island is wholly good or wholly evil, though, so I don't know that a strict duality can really apply.
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Nah, showing the BiB the other village is counter-productive to the Mother's goals. And here's my other theory. Perhaps it was the light that was doing the impersonation of Claudia. This would explain as to why the ghosts have a light before MiB is tossed into the cave and they lose the spotlight after the light goes out and smokey emerges. Same MO, just one has better lighting technicians. It required Jacob to throw MiB into the light so it could escape it's prison of light.
 
Dual said:
When Jacob forced the MiB into the light cave, it seemed like the light became darkness, and the darkness became Smokey. The fake mother had earlier said that the cave contained life, death, and rebirth, so I took that to mean that MiB's insertion did something to break the balance. We didn't see the cave after he got shot out, did we? That would've been helpful. I think that maybe Smokey actually is the light, just animated by MiB's understandably pissed off soul. Jacob's task then would've become keeping his non-corporeal brother on the island, and thereby protecting the light, or something. Incoherent rambling ftw.

Some people on The Fuselage seem to think that the fake mother was both the predecessor of Jacob and the MiB, since there were some hints about smokish-evil - burning the village, killing the real mother, even perhaps her initial affinity for the MiB. It's clear that nobody on the island is wholly good or wholly evil, though, so I don't know that a strict duality can really apply.
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More rambling along this train of thought...

This seems to make some sense in that every character who seems to know anything about how the island works insists that if the smoke monster/MiB leaves, "everything will end". I think Dual's take on it points in the right direction: Jacob's task is to keep the smoke monster, now the keeper of "the light", on the island, because leaving might cause it to snuff out, ending all life (something MiB doesn't seem to give a shit about, and this last episode is meant mostly to explain how his obsessiveness might perhaps blind him to this; maybe he's got a plan to overcome it.)

Perhaps, also, all the elctromagnetic phenomena (located at different points on the island around the "source" --in a Dharma octagon pattern...?) are there to keep the source-energy coherent. When it leaves, it'll discorporate. This might also explain how, after all this time, MiB found a "loophole" only after one of those EM pockets was eliminated: The Swan station.

Too many quotation marks...need to learn how to speak in Lostish.
 
Cassie said:
Even after having another day to think about this episode, I still think it was DULL. None of the stuff they revealed really mattered that much. It doesn't change anything to know who Adam and Eve were. It made that mystery completely pointless. Finding out what makes the island special turned it from a little bit sci fi, to a whole lot fantasy. I like fantasy, but I don't like it when I can't tell the difference because the writers switch it up. Electromagnetism is now sacred light, or some shit.

Lost is turning out to be a lot like BSG in that sense. Lots of mystic stuff that was interesting, but has now snowballed so that the writers are left to make some lame last minute explanations to tie it all together. I'm sure the ending won't be completely satisfying, but we'll still appreciate the series as a whole.
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Cassie, you wrote exactly what I've been thinking. I'm almost dreading the last 3.5 hours, instead of being excited. I am hopint the last eps will be as good-no GREAT-as "Ab Aeterno" was.
 
I'll echo that, I haven't seen such a blatant waste of an episode since the one about Jack's tattoos.

Plus why didn't we get to here MIB's name?

Are they saving that to the last episode, or is this something we will never know?

With only a few hours left of this show I really could have done with this episode either answering more questions that it raised, or actually featuring people we care about, other than in some 20 second clip from an old episode.

Having those two be Adam and Eve is even more disappointing since we don't know either of their real names.

Also MIB, not that evil really, either Jacob, or more likely their step mother killed all MIB's friends, and she nearly brained him, she killed his real mother, and doomed both of them to eternal life stuck on that island, and the only thing he did was kill the person who killed his own mother, all his friends, and doomed him, and she seemed grateful for it.

And in return he gets turned into the smoke monster by his own brother?

MIB could still turn out to be the misunderstood hero of the piece, while Jacob is the manipulative bastard using real lives as chess pieces (or backgammon)
 
I can't be bothered going into a long discussion about the plot points tonight (and nothing we mention will actually end up being relevant to the show in anyway.)

But leaving aside any disappointment to the answers to the big questions, the episode was still pretty shit on its own merit. Like the scene where the mother shows the two boys the magic glowing cave was just terrible. And the scene where MiB (WHY THE FUCK DIDN'T THE JUST GIVE HIM A NAME) said something like "I will leave this island! And I'll show you how when I do!" Who speaks like that? There were lots of clumsy lines that seemed inserted to reference something that will happen two thousand years later.

Oh, and the ending pissed me off because by showing that scene from season one it was as if the writers were patting themselves on the back saying "SEE, WE HAD IT ALL PLANNED OUT." Except of course they missed out Jack saying that the bodies were no more than fifty years old. Rather than two thousand years old.
 
Maybe it was related to the healing effects of the island? Not sure what condition the bodies in the DHARMA pit were in, by comparison.

MiB's name will presumably turn out to be something significant, because not telling us just for the sake of it would be overly pedantic even for Lost.
 
I think MiB just never had a name. Claudia had only picked one for Jacob, and it's not too inconceivable that fake-mother might have been crazy enough to let MiB go unnamed. Speaking from personal experience, when I was crazy, I didn't name my cats. :S:
 
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